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What is your Unpopular [non-US coin] Numismatic Opinion


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Saw this thread on the Reddit subforum for US Coins and thought it could be fun to do for our non-US forum.

Basically, state an opinion you have related to numismatics you think is unpopular but that you still go by. 

For example… you like coins in slabs! 
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I’ll kick things off… If I had to choose between a lower grade gold coin, and a higher grade silver or provincial, all else equal I’d pick the higher grade non gold coin 🙊

Please just remember the forum rules are still in effect so don’t go shaming people for their opinions. All in good fun here 🙂 except slabbers… 

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Just kidding 🙂

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Athens owl tetradrachms are kinda meh to me. I don't think they look particularly nice, and for how common they are they are damn expensive. I prefer new style owl tetradrachms over the old style. I'd be happy if i suddenly owned one, but I wouldn't pay for one. The only cool thing to me is the history behind them, but it's not enough for me to justify buying one. I'd rather buy a hellenistic tetradrachm for the same price.

 

image.png.eab945ec219f49a304a0479fb56a54b9.png

Not my coin but I prefer the more realistic portrait of Athena

Edited by Cordoba
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I agree with both of the foregoing. First, the only Athens Owl I have is still the one with test cuts on both sides that I bought at the 2007 NYINC for about $300, and would probably cost not much more to buy today. If someone gave me $1,000 and told me I could spend all or any part of it on a single ancient coin, an upgraded Owl would not be among my first 10 or 15 choices. I simply don't think they're all that interesting, and they're not ever going to be difficult to find. 

Second, I've mentioned before that my collection of 5-pound AR British crowns stops at 2002 -- I think most of the 90+ (!) that the Royal Mint has issued since then are embarrassingly absurd and don't deserve the name "commemorative."

 

Edited by DonnaML
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Well, here are two: 

Romans: everything after the Severan dynasty doesn't do it for me (except for a few Constantine coins). Reason: I find it kind of depressing that the empire went down hill from there and collecting coins from that time period makes me sad 😞

Another one: I find Greek coins very complicated, and the collecting field to be very 'cluttered' (used google translate). I cant find the motivation to properly study and start collecting them, and the high prices don't help either. 

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My unpopular opinions

- I consider some coins overrated/overpriced and I don't intend to purchase them, unless the prices would be extremely low (highly unlikely). Athens tetradrachms or very rare emperors. Rather than spending a large sum (at least for me) for these,  I would prefer getting 10 overlooked coins, that are way more interesting for me.
- (related) rather than spending 500 euros for a coin, let's say, a denarius in fantastic condition (especially if the design/historical importance is not appealing), I prefer getting 8-10 denarii in lower grade but having a unique design, or strong symbolistic. 

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I can't get excited about Athenian owls, but that seems to be a fairly common "unpopular" opinion.  I've been collecting ancients for nearly 30 years, never owned an Owl, don't plan to.  

I also only made a very half-hearted attempt at a 12 Caesars set.  I have silver for the more common, bronze for the ones whose silver is scarce, and am completely missing Otho.  He was utterly insignificant in the grand scheme of Roman history, so I can't motivate myself to pay a lot for a coin of his (even if his wig is pretty hilarious).  It's a very arbitrary grouping of rulers anyway, just because Suetonius wrote an entertaining book about them doesn't make it an exciting collection group to me.

It's not solely numismatic, but I hate, with a hugely over-inflated passion, the Wade-Giles system of transliterating Chinese.  I think I may have a repressed childhood trauma, when Wade-GIles ran over my dog. 😭  But Wade-Giles still shows up sometimes in numismatic discussions, and I have to quickly figure out the Pinyin equivalents.

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I definitely have some controversial opinions…the majority of greek and roman coins are unbearably boring. Nothing would excite me less than another alexander tetradrachm, athenian tetradrachm, or a denarius with yet another right facing imperial portrait and standing deity reverse. I tend to find roman imperial portraiture bland and ugly. Perhaps only a select few sestertii or aurerii of fine style stand out. The rest blur together in a lifeless mirage of imperial “grandeur”  
 

I also am not a fan of how well understood greek and roman coinage is. Such levels of knowledge leave little room for the collector to make exciting discoveries or add to the scholarship in a meaningful way.
 

I also am not excited nor intrigued when a denarius or similar coin becomes rare or “unpublished” because of an additional dot or some other extremely trivial aspect on the coin.

🙂these are my controversial opinions. I am glad not everyone collects what I like or I couldn’t afford it myself

Edited by TheTrachyEnjoyer
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I suppose that my current interest in imitation owls goes against the collecting trend somewhat.  It is difficult being a nonconformist, since in a way it is another form of conformity.  Still, the thrust of interest has been centered on Athenian standardized owls, with lots of cash spent on slabbed "full crest" examples.  Of course some imitations bring high hammer prices from time to time; to my fellow imitation owl collectors I say welcome the nonconformist club!  When it gets too large we'll need to form a subgroup of nonconformists of the nonconformists.

Another somewhat against the collecting grain for me is that corroded, even salvaged coins are okay, of course up to a degree.  This applies especially to otherwise rare coins or interesting varieties.  Still, even here, there is a high demand for salvaged coins, especially if the coin is accompanied by a certificate. 

Actually, that's another opinion that I have, for Spanish colonial coins.  I really do not like, nor do I seek coins with certificates.  Some folks collect for the certificate.  That's fine for them, but not for me; I always buy the coin, not the slab and its rating or the certificate signed by Mel Fisher or anyone else for that mater.  I know that the lack of a certificate can affect resale value, but I really don't care much - let the coin sell itself!   

 

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I'm not sure how unpopular it is on this forum to say modern commemoratives are rubbish 🤣 Collecting those might be less popular than slabs around here.

Here are a few unpopular opinions. They're hugely generalised, of course, but that's the name of the game. Hopefully no-one is offended - after all, I collect Celtic bronzes, Golden Horde dangs and Charles I farthings, so I know unpopular 😁

1 - Greek is a beauty parade, and shallow for it. At the same time, as Limes said, it's far too complicated. A bit like medieval Germany. I don't care enough to study it. There are some outstanding coins I have now ruled myself out of acquiring, but that's probably a good thing, as I can't afford them!

2 - Roman Republic (pre-Triumvirate) has too many homogeneous portraits of gods. Gods are all very well, but they're, um, fictional, and do little to add to the history. It reminds me of US coins - they haven't tied themselves to the current monarch, and yet produce endless unflattering depictions of Liberty. You had a blank canvas...

3 - Rarity is often a matter of definition. Which feature gets singled out for special treatment.

4 - A lot of extremely expensive coins are really boring. Most of them, even. See 1-3 above. (Lucky this isn't about US coins!)

5 - By contrast, a monarch/emperor makes a coin more interesting. Even if they're hateful. Especially if they're hateful. I like Commodus on a coin 🤣 Yes, they're on every coin from their reign. But there's someone to put the coin immediately into historical context. Suddenly the gods are interesting - as expressions of the person's personality.

6 - Tokens are collectable. Counterfeits are collectable. Elongated coins are collectable. With the caveat that they all must've been made long before I was born.

7 - Purposefully defaced, countermarked, test cut and chopmarked coins are collectable. Dare I say, more so than mint state coins. They weren't taken straight off the press and put in a bag. Someone in the past actually used them. Expressed themselves on them. It isn't 'damage'. It's adding a story to the piece. That's what history is. It's only bad if it's someone trying to make the coin more saleable to collectors e.g. tooling.

8 - Attributing someone else's coins is fun. Even if they're Chinese or Arabic. Especially if they're Chinese or Arabic. It's better than Sudoku, anyway.

Edited by John Conduitt
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We should melt down all byzantine and Chinese bronze coins and give the metal to Habitats For Humanity. 

Any and all coins (books, art etc) with religious leaders on them should also be melted down and then farted on for good measure. 

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4 hours ago, Cordoba said:

and for how common they are they are damn expensive.

Funny, this is my opinion but for the new styles (but your opinion is still pretty accurate IMO for the classical owls). I haven’t studied them in depth but they do not seem particularly rare/hard to find, and I am left wondering why they are so expensive. I guess they are that popular. 

Edited by ValiantKnight
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Archival safe plastic flips are rubbish. They are brittle, easily wear out, expensive, non traditional, and ugly. Removing coins from them (especially saflips) is a pain. For the life of me I cannot understand why they are so popular. 

It goes without saying that the softer non archival safe plastic flips are rubbish too. But that's a given. ;)

Edited by David Atherton
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1 hour ago, Ryro said:

We should melt down all byzantine and Chinese bronze coins and give the metal to Habitats For Humanity. 

Any and all coins (books, art etc) with religious leaders on them should also be melted down and then farted on for good measure. 

Wouldn’t this mean all Roman Imperial coins too since the Caesar’s were religious leaders as Pontifex Maximus?!

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Some collectors will find my opinions unpopular, whereas other collectors share my attitude. This is my approach to collecting:

  • I'm not impressed by high-grade material and I think technical grade is over-emphasized. Rarity is much more impressive.
  • I like fly-specking, and enjoy categorizing bust varieties, hairstyles, and that sort of thing.
  • Depth is better than breadth, and I'm more impressed with a collection of 100 different denarii of Septimius Severus that includes rare mints and varieties than I am with a one of each emperor and caesar collection.
  • I'm fascinated by the technical aspects of coin production and I like brockages, double-strikes, coins so off-center you can see the lathe-turning marks on the flans, flan chips and casting sprue, etc.
  • Just like pugs and bulldogs are so ugly they are cute, I am enamored with the naive charm of a coin with comically bad artistry or bad spelling.
  • I think barbarous imitations, ancient counterfeits, unofficial issues and the like are interesting artifacts in themselves.
Edited by Roman Collector
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My opinion is that coin jewellery is tacky or dare I say trashy, especially with modern coins. Also with ancients I don't care if the coin was used in jewellery, in fact I'm more likely to buy it due to the lower cost as long as the main elements are not disturbed (now cuff links- they totally ruin a coin). Call me superstitious but I don't believe in wearing ancient coins/artefacts as jewels, it's one thing to buy them, admire them and putting it away on the shelf, but it's different when you make a coin into a pendent or straight up wearing ancient rings all day every day, which makes them more personal along with whatever history (known or unknown) that comes with it.

My second point being that I believe to an extent coin collecting is an investment, not a great way to invest, but still you're converting you fiat into something that holds it's value over time. Recently I checked my spreadsheet and I was shocked to see how much I've spend in the last 4 years, even though I couldn't get back the 100% resale value, I'm sure I can get at least 2/3rd which is still a substantial amount. If you think it's just fun money, you can still somehow retrieve that money if you wanted, even if you never want to sell you collection and decide to pass it onto your kids, either they have a head start in their numismatic journey by freeing up their finances, or they can simply decide to sell and get that money. You can't say the same for other hobbies that require your personal time and effort for the happiness that you'll get. 

Edited by JayAg47
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It's easy to conflate "controversial" with merely "negative".

I can't really think of any opinions that would be considered controversial here...unless it be that I don't find any particular area of ancient coins boring or uninteresting. Even those outside of my main collecting interest - e.g. Byzantine, China, Eastern kingdoms, medieval, etc. - I find interesting and intriguing, for the history if nothing else.

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1 hour ago, David Atherton said:

Archival safe plastic flips are rubbish. They are brittle, easily wear out, expensive, non traditional, and ugly. Removing coins from them (especially saflips) is a pain. For the life of me I cannot understand why they are so popular. 

It goes without saying that the softer non archival safe plastic flips are rubbish too. But that's a given. 😉

 

You make some good points, but in defense of plastic flips I offer the following:

1. They are better than cardboard flips (You can remove the coin, there is much more room for coin information, etc.)

2. They are better than paper envelopes (you can actually see the coin without removing it)

3. They may not be as pretty as red velvet trays, but they are much less expensive

4. They offer some protection to the coin (nice when showing coins to other people). Also, they somewhat isolate the coins from each other (nice when trying to deal with BD)

5. They are easily and safely transportable in boxes or albums

6. Storage can be made more compact and more uniform

 

Eventually I'd like to get a nice wooden coin cabinet, but in the meantime, I can't think of any better way to store my coins that offers a significant advantage above plastic flips.

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11 minutes ago, CPK said:

 

You make some good points, but in defense of plastic flips I offer the following:

1. They are better than cardboard flips (You can remove the coin, there is much more room for coin information, etc.)

2. They are better than paper envelopes (you can actually see the coin without removing it)

3. They may not be as pretty as red velvet trays, but they are much less expensive

4. They offer some protection to the coin (nice when showing coins to other people). Also, they somewhat isolate the coins from each other (nice when trying to deal with BD)

5. They are easily and safely transportable in boxes or albums

6. Storage can be made more compact and more uniform

 

Eventually I'd like to get a nice wooden coin cabinet, but in the meantime, I can't think of any better way to store my coins that offers a significant advantage above plastic flips.

Couldn't agree more.

I've tried the paper flips, and they too are nice, for compact storage, I like to see my coins, not having to flip them in the long box, trying to find a specific one, even though it's labeled.

I will say though, I use paper holders for my Byzantine cup coins and some of the more annoying sized coins. I have many world and medieval coins, in paper envelopes.

But for ancients, plastic flips are it.

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Here it goes.....

1. I absolutely despise low-grade coins. I don't care if a coin is extremely rare; I'm not interested if I have to imagine what it was intended to look like. For me, a high-grade common coin is always superior to a low-grade rarity. That is not to say that I don't appreciate a high-grade rarity if my budget allows it! Perhaps this is not so controversial as others have already echoed this sentiment.

2. I don't understand the appeal of small provincial bronzes. In addition to often being aesthetically crude, they just seem dinky to me.

3. I would prefer that people who lack a background in ancient history, whether it's formal (education) or informal (personal interest), stay away from ancients. 

4. Not fond of slabs....but this is probably the least controversial opinion among ancients' collectors. 

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