Filat Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 (edited) Diva Faustina Senior в синих кругах мы видим крупные каверны (объединение мелких пузырьков воздуха, которые лопнули в процессе литья данного изделия) → in blue circles we see large cavities (a combination of small air bubbles that burst during the casting of this product); в желтых кругах мы видим множество мелких пузырьков воздуха, которые не лопнули, в процессе литья данного изделия → in the yellow circles we see a lot of small air bubbles that did not burst during the casting process of this product. Edited February 5, 2023 by Filat 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleun96 Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 I'm having a hard time seeing any burst bubbles in most of those blue circles. The majority of them look like shadows or deposits to me, inconclusive at best. The photo quality from the original listing doesn't seem to be quite good enough to say much more IMO. Is there any other evidence that this is a fake, such as a die match to a known fake example? I'm not too familiar with aureii so can't say much about the surface bumps, could it perhaps be die rust? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 5, 2023 31 minutes ago, Kaleun96 said: 'm having a hard time seeing any burst bubbles in most of those blue circles. см. дополнительную картинку ниже (see additional picture below): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleun96 Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 8 minutes ago, Filat said: см. дополнительную картинку ниже (see additional picture below): Sorry I'm not convinced. What you've circled could be anything, there's not nearly enough detail to conclusively say whether what you have circled are actually bubbles or just shadows, deposits, scrapes, specular highlights etc. I'm open to other evidence if you have it but the blue circles, for me, don't point to anything conclusive. The yellow circles may just be highlighting die rust or similar features from the die like flow lines. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 5, 2023 25 minutes ago, Kaleun96 said: I'm not convinced сожалею (I regret.). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 39 minutes ago, Filat said: см. дополнительную картинку ниже (see additional picture below): You've circled pretty much the entire image. Could you maybe circle just a few of the most obvious cases that you think are casting bubbles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 5, 2023 8 minutes ago, velarfricative said: Could you maybe circle just a few of the most obvious cases that you think are casting bubbles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Collector Posted February 5, 2023 · Patron Share Posted February 5, 2023 I have a couple of questions for you, @Filat: What is your purpose in posting this? Is it to warn others not to bid on a certain coin in a certain auction? If so, you should post the link to the auction listing. How did this end up in a slab if it's so obviously a cast fake? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 5, 2023 20 minutes ago, Roman Collector said: How did this end up in a slab if it's so obviously a cast fake? у меня тот же вопрос (i have the same question). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prieure de Sion Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 I think - this is my opinion - an accusation that a coin is a forgery is sometimes a harsh accusation. Especially when the accusation is made against a seller. So I think it's important that when you call a coin a fake, you have to be able to justify it professionally. To say or write - here these are bubbles, here this is a notch, this is wrong - it is not enough to show the disturbing elements (in this case the bubbles) - you also have to be able to explain what you see (here the bubbles) and why (technically) these bubbles are irrefutable proof of a forgery. From my point of view, you can't just say, here's a bubble, so it's a fake, you should write, here's a bubble, it's a fake, because bubbles occur because etc. etc. An accusation of a fake is quickly written and should also be proven with background and expertise. I have often read the accusation "this is a fake!" in forums - and in the end it turned out not to be a fake after all. But the written word, the allegation, remains on the internet - and the internet does not forget. Of course, I don't mean to attack anyone. My 2 cents. Long story short - I still don't know exactly why it should be a fake. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaleun96 Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Filat said: I have the same question (i have the same question). Many of the aureii in that auction have similar surfaces to this coin, are all of them fake as well? I'm just trying to understand how what you have circled is different to die rust and markings from worn dies (for the non-burst bubbles) or how you can conclusively say the "burst bubbles" aren't just deposits, shadows, dust, or similar when the pictures are so pixelated at that level of zoom. For example: https://coins.ha.com/itm/roman-imperial/ancient-coins/ancients-hadrian-ad-117-138-av-aureus-20mm-700-gm-6h-ngc-au-5-5-5-5-fine-style/a/3056-30013.s https://coins.ha.com/itm/roman-imperial/ancient-coins/ancients-antoninus-pius-ad-138-161-av-aureus-19mm-707-gm-6h-ngc-choice-au-5-5-4-5/a/3056-30028.s https://coins.ha.com/itm/roman-imperial/ancient-coins/ancients-lucius-verus-ad-161-169-av-aureus-19mm-727-gm-6h-ngc-gem-ms-5-5-5-5/a/3056-30118.s Edited February 5, 2023 by Kaleun96 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryro Posted February 5, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted February 5, 2023 Man, I hate it when I get blue spots all over my gold coins as well. Though, they do wash off with distilled water and a soft toothbrush. 1 3 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo123 Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 And what about flow lines on coin ? Never see this on cast ! 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ominus1 Posted February 5, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted February 5, 2023 ..man fake coins is one of my collecting zones...:D a couple in my lot by the Master Carl Becker.. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLTcoins Posted February 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 5, 2023 25 minutes ago, Ricardo123 said: And what about flow lines on coin ? Never see this on cast ! Respectfully, well-made modern casts reproduce fine detail from the host almost perfectly, including flow lines. Microscopic flow lines of the sort that produce luster on mint state coins are another story but they are often difficult to discern even under magnification. Those who think they are authenticating ancient coins by the presence of flow lines visible to the naked eye should think again. Caveat emptor. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 6, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 6, 2023 (edited) Faustina Junior в желтых кругах мы видим множество мелких пузырьков воздуха, которые не лопнули, в процессе литья данного изделия → in the yellow circles we see a lot of small air bubbles that did not burst during the casting process of this product. Edited February 6, 2023 by Filat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonW Posted February 6, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 6, 2023 (edited) I don't see anything wrong with either of the two coins. Both look perfectly fine and authentic. @Filat, what you are circling in blue are mostly shadows and in yellow some minor bumps and metal irregularities, which actually speak for the coins' authenticity and not against it. Edited February 6, 2023 by SimonW 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 6, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 6, 2023 14 minutes ago, SimonW said: in yellow some minor bumps and metal irregularities, which actually speak for the coins' authenticity and not against it. несерьезно (not serious). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heliodromus Posted February 6, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 6, 2023 On a less exciting level, here's some definite LRB fakes in the latest Bertolami auction: https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986541/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-05g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986542/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-23g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986544/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-12g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted February 6, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted February 6, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Heliodromus said: On a less exciting level, here's some definite LRB fakes in the latest Bertolami auction: https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986541/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-05g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986542/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-23g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false https://www.sixbid.com/en/bertolami-fine-arts/10406/roman-imperial/8986544/constans-337-350-ae-18mm-3-12g?term&orderCol=lot_number&orderDirection=asc&priceFrom&displayMode=large&auctionSessions=12012|478441&sidebarIsSticky=false Thank you. Why are these fake? Ok, the last two are exactly the same 🤣 Edited February 6, 2023 by John Conduitt 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heliodromus Posted February 6, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 6, 2023 4 hours ago, John Conduitt said: Why are these fake? Ok, the last two are exactly the same Yes, and they are both well known fakes - appeared on eBay in fairly large quantities 5 or so years ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akeady Posted February 6, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted February 6, 2023 4 hours ago, John Conduitt said: Thank you. Why are these fake? Ok, the last two are exactly the same 🤣 All to do with bubbles, I suppose... ATB, Aidan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo123 Posted February 7, 2023 · Member Share Posted February 7, 2023 19 hours ago, Filat said: несерьезно (not serious). Listen Mr filat, you circle about 100 « proofs » of forgery in the first picture of aureus. Do you really think NGC miss that with the coin in their hand ??? You better than experts who work with thousands of coins ??? Be serious yourself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Filat Posted February 7, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted February 7, 2023 18 minutes ago, Ricardo123 said: Do you really think NGC miss that with the coin in their hand ??? к сожалению, → это именно так (Unfortunately, → this is exactly the case.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPK Posted February 7, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted February 7, 2023 @Filat, what sort of numismatic background do you have? Can you give me a reason why I should take your opinions over those of NGC and multiple auction houses? I'd appreciate it if you could answer in English. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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