expat Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 I guess we are seeing part of the results of his plea bargain agreement to avoid a custodial sentence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor kirispupis Posted May 2 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted May 2 51 minutes ago, discoinfiltrator said: Update - they've confirmed via email that they are ceasing operations as a company. I had some winning bids in the last E-Sale and got an email to that effect asking for me to pay my invoice by the 13th May. Wow! So, I was actually correct! That doesn't happen often... I must say it's with mixed emotions. On the one hand, a number of my favorite coins came from them, including several rarities I'm not sure I would have found elsewhere. They were also very nice in my conversations with them and always shipped quickly. They were the only auction house I've dealt with that used the little boxes, which I've been re-using to gift coins. Luckily I still have a fair-sized stack of them. On the other hand, I can't condone falsifying provenance and selling looted coins. I also strongly suspected, though could never prove, that they practiced predictive shill bidding for some time (shill bidding when they know your max). There were several coins that I purchased for my max and in retrospect should never have gone that high. I expect that I'll never know for sure, but the suspicion was enough that I significantly curtailed my spending with them over the last year to only high priority coins. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo123 Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 And what about my auction reward ??? I did SILVER member there ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prieure de Sion Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 58 minutes ago, Bonshaw said: The never expiring guarantee just expired. But thats a problem of all sellers and auctionhouses. 1 hour ago, Hrefn said: Just received an invoice from Roma from the latest E-auction confirming they are ceasing operation May 24th. It is official. Thats very sad... I like Roma Numismatics and liked to win there coins. Very sad for me 😞 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prieure de Sion Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 6 minutes ago, Ricardo123 said: And what about my auction reward ??? I did SILVER member there ! Shit - i have un-used points. I collect all points of all auction over the years... and now?!? OH NO!!!! 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hrefn Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 🎶. Arrivederci Roma 🎶🎶🎶🎶 Some one please cue Dean Martin. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molag Bal Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 Rip Roma. I got a number of nice coins from them including my profile pic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
expat Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 58 minutes ago, Deinomenid said: As did all the Roma points! I haven't bought much from them but I just managed to get to the points threshold to redeem my Roma points for the first time in this last auction 🤣 It doesn't seem us bronze customers get the email. At least the coins arrived. Maybe we can sell the little boxes in the future as historical artefacts, as moderns collectors do with slab cases. It's a pity Roma have shut (they were a UK auction house, which is less postage for me!) but I hope Richard Beale doesn't reappear in charge of another auction house. We really could do without smuggling and false provenances, which will just end in more draconian rules for everyone. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonshaw Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 (edited) SUGGESTION to any former Roma buyer: If you want your auction webpage on Roma preserved, even if the romanumismatics.com web page goes away, I suggest that you make sure that it is uploaded on the Wayback Machine. 1) Go to https://web.archive.org/ 2) Enter your auction web page into the URL search box. As an example, I'm putting in https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1387-trajan-av-aureus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail (example only, I didn't buy this coin) 3) If you see: ------------- Hrm. Wayback Machine has not archived that URL. This page is available on the web! Help make the Wayback Machine more complete! ((Save this URL on the Wayback Machine)) ------------- This means that this auction is *not* archived. 4) In that case, click the ((Save this URL on the Wayback Machine)) button 5) Then click "Save Page" button For this example auction, I get: "Saving page https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1387-trajan-av-aureus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail" and then "Saving" with a rolling progress icon. You may have to wait awhile as it lists all of the linked pages that it is crawling. 6) When you get a green "Done!" button, it is archived. 7) To check, go back to https://web.archive.org/, and put in the Roma URL again I just put in that example URL above, and now I get a calendar, with "Saved 1 time May 2, 2024". Clicking on "May 2, 2024" shows me an archived copy of this sale, including the hammer price. 8 and finally) Record the URL of your auction, so that you can easily find it / refer to it on the Wayback Machine! And you are done. Your auction web page is preserved in perpetuity. Edited May 2 by Bonshaw 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heliodromus Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 9 minutes ago, kirispupis said: I must say it's with mixed emotions. Yeah, it's a bit of a shame. In many ways they were excellent, but there was a recurring element of sleaziness there too, apparently right from the start with Beale's association with Athena Numismatics (he was a director) and smuggling of coins from Gaza, to this final Eid Mar chapter. I was always annoyed seeing Roma flip eBay purchases and add bullshit provenance such as "From the collection of an English gentleman". Nobody would have cared less if they were selling LRBs without provenance, but it seems there was just a compulsion to lie about it. The fuzzy black boxes will be missed. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry G Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 (edited) That's a big shame - I've spent far too much money with them, and consigned quite a bit as well! I can't seem to use my points on a purchase from their shop unfortunately. It just managed to add an item to my cart and now I can't seem to remove it! Also, I had some lots go unsold in their last auction. Hopefully they... uhh... send them back to me... Edited May 2 by Harry G 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heliodromus Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 24 minutes ago, Harry G said: Also, I had some lots go unsold in their last auction. Hopefully they... uhh... send them back to me... Presumably so. https://www.numismatikforum.de/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=69680 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 28 minutes ago, Harry G said: Also, I had some lots go unsold in their last auction. Hopefully they... uhh... send them back to me... Otherwise, that would be theft to add to the list. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cazador Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 Great Auction House , sad day for Numismatics 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greekcoin21 Posted May 2 · Member Share Posted May 2 Sad to hear this, I’ve had some interesting coins from them over the last few years. In business reputation is everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor DonnaML Posted May 2 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted May 2 It seems quite likely that Richard Beale agreed with the DA's office, to avoid incarceration, that he would no longer engage in the ancient coin trade. If he attempted to sell the business as a going concern, he was obviously unsuccessful. There may be no remaining coin inventory to dispose of that Roma owns itself, and it wouldn't surprise me if its cash in the bank and accounts receivable will be used up paying consignors and other creditors, as well as to pay whatever fines and penalties the court imposes. Not to mention making restitution to the buyer of the confiscated Eid Mar, assuming that the buyer made payment. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted May 2 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted May 2 I think that I have enough of their gift boxes for the construction of an addition to the house. Getting permits from the city might be a big problem, though. Yes, their demise is rather sad but, in retrospect, almost inevitable given the legal cloud hanging over them. I began acquiring coins from them in 2018, picking up in volume from that point. They were a major source for ancient and to a lesser degree world coins for me. It seems that buying coins overseas is just becoming more problematic. Even domestic shipments seem to be having issues with the USPS, with one eBay return pinballing between post offices in Florida for nearly a month. Also, auction venues tend to be very costly for me. So, I think I'll concentrate on CNG, but to a more limited extent and check out the offerings on VCoins an MA Shops. Time to move on.... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor DonnaML Posted May 2 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted May 2 2 hours ago, Bonshaw said: SUGGESTION to any former Roma buyer: If you want your auction webpage on Roma preserved, even if the romanumismatics.com web page goes away, I suggest that you make sure that it is uploaded on the Wayback Machine. 1) Go to https://web.archive.org/ 2) Enter your auction web page into the URL search box. As an example, I'm putting in https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1387-trajan-av-aureus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail (example only, I didn't buy this coin) 3) If you see: ------------- Hrm. Wayback Machine has not archived that URL. This page is available on the web! Help make the Wayback Machine more complete! ((Save this URL on the Wayback Machine)) ------------- This means that this auction is *not* archived. 4) In that case, click the ((Save this URL on the Wayback Machine)) button 5) Then click "Save Page" button For this example auction, I get: "Saving page https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1387-trajan-av-aureus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail" and then "Saving" with a rolling progress icon. You may have to wait awhile as it lists all of the linked pages that it is crawling. 6) When you get a green "Done!" button, it is archived. 7) To check, go back to https://web.archive.org/, and put in the Roma URL again I just put in that example URL above, and now I get a calendar, with "Saved 1 time May 2, 2024". Clicking on "May 2, 2024" shows me an archived copy of this sale, including the hammer price. 8 and finally) Record the URL of your auction, so that you can easily find it / refer to it on the Wayback Machine! And you are done. Your auction web page is preserved in perpetuity. Won't all their auctions be preserved, at least for now, on Numisbids and Sixbids? 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted May 2 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted May 2 And acsearch as well. They seem to have auction results for individual coins running back to the 2010s 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonshaw Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 Yes, the stats / description / hammer price for the auction are preserved on these other sites, but not necessarily all of the details. Saving on wayback ensures that you preserve all of the details of the auction that are on the Roma website to maximize provenance information. The wayback machine preserves links to (and copies of) terms & conditions, everything. It is a "nice to have," not a "have to have." For me, it is worth it. ALL of these sites are vulnerable. Numisbids / sixbids could go away anytime if the businesses fail, or if management decides to purge their archive or take it offline. ACSearch could disappear if defunded. Even the Internet Archive (a non profit) could be sued out of existence. For me, it is just one additional way to preserve provenance. The more the better, especially since it is free. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 31 minutes ago, Bonshaw said: Yes, the stats / description / hammer price for the auction are preserved on these other sites, but not necessarily all of the details. Saving on wayback ensures that you preserve all of the details of the auction that are on the Roma website to maximize provenance information. The wayback machine preserves links to (and copies of) terms & conditions, everything. It is a "nice to have," not a "have to have." For me, it is worth it. ALL of these sites are vulnerable. Numisbids / sixbids could go away anytime if the businesses fail, or if management decides to purge their archive or take it offline. ACSearch could disappear if defunded. Even the Internet Archive (a non profit) could be sued out of existence. For me, it is just one additional way to preserve provenance. The more the better, especially since it is free. Hasn't worked for me. It saved the same page for every url! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonshaw Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 (edited) 2 minutes ago, John Conduitt said: Hasn't worked for me. It saved the same page for every url! @John Conduitt, that is strange. Can I try? Could you please post a URL that you would like archived, and that presently isn't? Or, you could DM it to me. Edited May 2 by Bonshaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Bonshaw said: @John Conduitt, that is strange. Can I try? Could you please post a URL that you would like archived, and that presently isn't? Or, you could DM it to me. These two show up as a different page when I search for them on Wayback: https://www.romanumismatics.com/235-lot-1554-gallienus-bi-antoninianus?auction_id=135&view=lot_detail https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1576-aemilian-ar-antoninianus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail https://web.archive.org/web/20240502211834/https://www.romanumismatics.com/235-lot-1554-gallienus-bi-antoninianus?auction_id=135&view=lot_detail https://web.archive.org/web/20240502211235/https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1576-aemilian-ar-antoninianus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail They are all https://www.romanumismatics.com/310-lot-202-sabina-wife-of-hadrian-ar-denarius?auction_id=218&view=lot_detail Edited May 2 by John Conduitt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonshaw Posted May 2 · Supporter Share Posted May 2 (edited) 25 minutes ago, John Conduitt said: These two show up as a different page when I search for them on Wayback: https://www.romanumismatics.com/235-lot-1554-gallienus-bi-antoninianus?auction_id=135&view=lot_detail https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1576-aemilian-ar-antoninianus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail https://web.archive.org/web/20240502211834/https://www.romanumismatics.com/235-lot-1554-gallienus-bi-antoninianus?auction_id=135&view=lot_detail https://web.archive.org/web/20240502211235/https://www.romanumismatics.com/286-lot-1576-aemilian-ar-antoninianus?auction_id=187&view=lot_detail They are all https://www.romanumismatics.com/310-lot-202-sabina-wife-of-hadrian-ar-denarius?auction_id=218&view=lot_detail Holy cow, you're right! It seems to be a problem on Wayback, or in the interaction between Wayback and however you fed it the info. I've never seen that before. I poked around some more, and it looks like the Wayback Machine is buggy right now. I randomly chose lot 1300 in the same auction, tried to save it, and it wouldn't. I then went back and tried the page that I had saved in the original example. It briefly flashed a webpage giving the date, and then switched to "not saved." I waited a minute and tried again, and the web page I saved previously was back in the archive again. I recommend that we give the Wayback Machine a little time to itself. Maybe it will settle down and start working right again. Edited May 2 by Bonshaw 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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