velarfricative Posted July 11, 2022 · Member Share Posted July 11, 2022 (edited) I just noticed that this forum needs some Kushan coins, I'll help with that. I'll show off some (but not all) of the deities on Kanishka I's coinage. All coins feature the obverse of Kanishka standing at an altar, holding a spear and sacrificing; the reverse always has a Tamgha in the field, a symbol of uncertain meaning that changed with each ruler. First up is Mioro, sun god, radiate and making a blessing gesture; named as Helios on the earliest coins. Next is Athsho, god of fire and metals, holding a diadem; on some later coins he is depicted with tongs. On the dinars from his early reign, this god is identified as Hephaistos. Mao, the lunar deity; depicted with a sword and crescents on his shoulders. Identified as Selene on the earliest coins. Nana, holding an animal protome; spelled NANAIA in Greek. Frequently depicted on Kushan coins, and of Iranian origin. Oesho, an extremely syncretic deity, holding a trident, a water pot, a diadem, and a thunderbolt; the attributes he holds vary widely in number and type. Evidence exists that he was identified as Herakles on the earliest Greek issues, though here he is clearly identified with Shiva. Oado, god of winds, holding a billowing cloak; famous for disseminating along the silk road all the way to Japan. On the earliest coins, he is identified as Anemos. Finally, and most famously, the seated Buddha. Strictly speaking this is not the historical Buddha, who is depicted on other tets and is properly called Sakyamuni (SAKAMANO in Baktrian); this is Maitreya (ΜΗΤΡΑΓΟ in Baktrian), an eschatological Buddha who has yet to come. Two separate Buddhas are depicted on Kanishka's coinage, and not just one; Sakyamuni is by far the most common. There are 2 other gods missing here; Ardoxsho and Pharro. Both are exceedingly rare, and I have yet to get my own examples, but they can be found in museum collections. And there you have it, a small slice of Kanishka's bronze output; I'm only touching the surface here, there's plenty of other more esoteric bronze issues of his worth discussion, but for the time being I'll leave it at that. Edited July 11, 2022 by velarfricative 26 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus Alexander Posted July 12, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted July 12, 2022 What a fabulous array of Kanishka reverses, @velarfricative! All great coins, though of course the Buddha is extra special. I have an Oado: Also this smaller denomination, a "drachm" (17mm and 4.22g) that I've tentatively ID'd as Mao and coming from an alternate mint in Kashmir. Does that sound right to you? Going to some other emperors, here's Kujula Kadphises with Hercules on the reverse: And Vima Takto with himself(?) on the reverse: Vima Kadphises with Shiva: And finally, Huvishka with Mithra (either a late phase coin or an imitation... again, any help here much appreciated!) 17 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryro Posted July 12, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted July 12, 2022 Y'all are killing me with these amazing coins in an area I am just scratching the surface of and some barbarous imitations: 15 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeandAcre Posted July 12, 2022 · Member Share Posted July 12, 2022 Thanks to each of you for zeroing in about a field in which I can only learn more than the initial zero. The linguistic /cultural dynamics are Very cool. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted July 12, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted July 12, 2022 32 minutes ago, Severus Alexander said: What a fabulous array of Kanishka reverses, @velarfricative! All great coins, though of course the Buddha is extra special. I have an Oado: Also this smaller denomination, a "drachm" (17mm and 4.22g) that I've tentatively ID'd as Mao and coming from an alternate mint in Kashmir. Does that sound right to you? Going to some other emperors, here's Kujula Kadphises with Hercules on the reverse: And Vima Takto with himself(?) on the reverse: Vima Kadphises with Shiva: And finally, Huvishka with Mithra (either a late phase coin or an imitation... again, any help here much appreciated!) Very nice examples! You are correct that your drachm depicts Mao, the shoulder crescents are unique to that deity. Your Huvishka looks likely imitative, with a blundered tamgha and legends; but, that being said, many of his later issues have blundered legends as well, so it's hard to say for sure. Huvishka's coinage is vast and complex, and the conditions of the coins make it tough to study. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted July 12, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted July 12, 2022 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Ryro said: Y'all are killing me with these amazing coins in an area I am just scratching the surface of and some barbarous imitations: Only one of yours looks imitative, actually; the fifth one appears to be a small unit Huvishka imitation. The others are all official issues from their respective regions. Edited July 12, 2022 by velarfricative 3 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus Alexander Posted July 12, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted July 12, 2022 29 minutes ago, Ryro said: @Ryro, this coin is an earlier Post-Mauryan coin from Gandhara/Taxila c. 200-180 BCE (or possibly a bit later). These coins often have a piece clipped off the corner (as on my example below), for unknown reasons, like on some Mauryan coins. Yours doesn't have the clipped corner: Here are my notes on this coin, from various sources including Coin India: Taxila, now a UNESCO world heritage site, is located in the Punjab (Gandhara) and was an important commercial centre due to its location at the confluence of several trade routes. It also contained one of the oldest universities in the world. (Pushkalavati, the former capital of the Gandhara majajanapada, was further west.) After the death of Asoka in 232 BCE, the Mauryan Empire went into slow decline. The Khyber pass was left undefended, and the Bactrian kings invaded starting in 180 BCE (Demetrios I, then Menander I), taking over the area of Taxila. This coin is a civic issue from the transitional period while Mauryan power was waning. You're welcome! 😉 13 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Steve Posted July 12, 2022 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted July 12, 2022 (edited) INDIA, Kushan: Vima Kadphises AE tetradrachm circa 112-127 AD Diameter: 28 mm Weight: 16.88 grams Obverse: King standing facing, sacrificing at altar left, tamgha and club in right field, Greek legend around: BACIΛEVC BACIΛEWN CWTHP MEΓAC OOhMO KAΔΦICHC Reverse: Oesho (Siva) standing facing, Bull Nandi behind, nandipada at left, Kharoshthi legend around: maharajasa rajadirajasa sarvaloga isvarasa mahisvarasa vima kathphishasa tratara Reference: Göbl 762, MAC 3033 Other: 12 o'clock => a choice specimen with good legend and the king's name spelled fully (OOhMO KAΔΦICHC) Ex-stevex6 ... ummm, I wasn't sure if Sev-Alex was saying these coins are okay in this thread, or if he was saying keep these square coins outta here?? (but I couldn't resist posting it, because these square babies are so fricken cool, right?) Hi India, Pushkalavati AE 24x23, Square Hey, no clipped corner Ex-stevex6 Edited July 12, 2022 by Steve 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parthicus Posted July 12, 2022 · Member Share Posted July 12, 2022 Lots of nice Kushan bronzes here. I have a few Kushan coins, but for now I'll just share one reverse type that hasn't been shown yet in this thread: a didrachm (8.07 g) of Kanishka featuring the sun god on reverse, but where the sun god is identified as Helios rather than Mioro: 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyLuudje Posted August 7, 2022 · Member Share Posted August 7, 2022 I really like the design of Kushan coins. I have a few, I will make some pictures soon. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtis JJ Posted August 7, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted August 7, 2022 I don't have many (possibly only the following one), but I find many of the Kushan coins interesting for their bilingual legends. (That's a topic that fascinates me, how the coins show the collision of cultures; bilingual ones appear in particular kinds of contexts beginning, I think, in the Hellenistic period and continuing through to medieval Islamic and European coinage, among other places.) This particular Soter Megas / Vima Takto type, though, uses only Greek (plus a Tamgha). But his coins are right at the boundary between Greek & Kushan traditions. His later coins were bilingual, using Greek and, if I understand correctly, Prakrit written in Kharoshthi script on the reverses. It's also interesting that his identity only came to light with the discovery of the Rabatak inscription [wiki], a sort of Rosetta Stone for the Kushan world, “…an inscription written on a rock in the Bactrian language and the Greek script, which was found in 1993 at the site of Rabatak, near Surkh Kotal in Afghanistan.” From CNG's listing for a different example: "The legend reads only Soter Megas - the Great Savior, and the actual name of the issuing king long remained unknown. The discovery of the Rabatak inscription, though, changed Kushan history by providing evidence to verify the elusive identity of 'Soter Megas'. His name was Vima Tak[to] (the last syllable is still uncertain).” See also: Razieh Taasob 2008, “Language and Legend in Early Kushan Coinage: Progression and Transformation.” (I pulled the trigger on this one because it was from the Clain-Stefanelli Collection [formed c. 1930s-1990s; Vladimir: 1914-1982; Elivra: 1914-2001; and Alexander: 1943-2015], in which I have a particular interest.) 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamnaskires Posted August 7, 2022 · Member Share Posted August 7, 2022 Outstanding example, Curtis, with - interestingly - a very Western-looking bust compared to the typical Soter Megas portraits. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted August 8, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted August 8, 2022 On 8/7/2022 at 1:23 PM, Curtis JJ said: I don't have many (possibly only the following one), but I find many of the Kushan coins interesting for their bilingual legends. (That's a topic that fascinates me, how the coins show the collision of cultures; bilingual ones appear in particular kinds of contexts beginning, I think, in the Hellenistic period and continuing through to medieval Islamic and European coinage, among other places.) This particular Soter Megas / Vima Takto type, though, uses only Greek (plus a Tamgha). But his coins are right at the boundary between Greek & Kushan traditions. His later coins were bilingual, using Greek and, if I understand correctly, Prakrit written in Kharoshthi script on the reverses. It's also interesting that his identity only came to light with the discovery of the Rabatak inscription [wiki], a sort of Rosetta Stone for the Kushan world, “…an inscription written on a rock in the Bactrian language and the Greek script, which was found in 1993 at the site of Rabatak, near Surkh Kotal in Afghanistan.” From CNG's listing for a different example: "The legend reads only Soter Megas - the Great Savior, and the actual name of the issuing king long remained unknown. The discovery of the Rabatak inscription, though, changed Kushan history by providing evidence to verify the elusive identity of 'Soter Megas'. His name was Vima Tak[to] (the last syllable is still uncertain).” See also: Razieh Taasob 2008, “Language and Legend in Early Kushan Coinage: Progression and Transformation.” (I pulled the trigger on this one because it was from the Clain-Stefanelli Collection [formed c. 1930s-1990s; Vladimir: 1914-1982; Elivra: 1914-2001; and Alexander: 1943-2015], in which I have a particular interest.) Very nice Vima Takto! It was not Vima Takto, but his son, Vima Kadphises, who used Greek and Kharosthi on his main issues. Vima Takto had subsidiary mints that did make use of Kharosthi and Greek, however. Following the Vimas, all Kushan coins are monolingual, first in Greek and then in Bactrian for the remainder of their empire. 13 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Furryfrog02 Posted August 9, 2022 · Supporter Share Posted August 9, 2022 What a great selection of coins! I don't have too many Kushan coins but I do like the size and thickness of them. I wish I could find more resources to read up on their history. Here are the only three I have (They are not nearly as nice as the examples thus far): Emperor Huvishka Emperor Kanishka Emperor Vima Kadphises 15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panzerman Posted October 6, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 6, 2022 Here is my Kanishka I AV Dinara ND Peshawar Mint reverse: Moon Goddess 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsmit Posted October 6, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 6, 2022 There was a period in my collecting where I tried to get interested in Soter Megas and tried to assemble a representative selection. There are two denominations often called drachms and tetradrachms but I might call the units and quarter units not really knowing what the users called them. There were several mints (3 or 4???) often distinguished by style of the lettering. Some used rounded letters (note the W omegas) but can be squared. Sometimes the tamgha on one side or both have four prongs other than the usual three. The coins are dated by the number of rays on the crown BUT it is odd IMO since the earlier ones have the most rays (14???) while later ones go down (to 5???). That means I really did not like coins off center enough to not show countable rays or letters of the ones that were different. The four denomination is not all that easy to find full legend so I compromised and bought the awful obverse to get the full reverse legend. It also shows the weapon/ax of the king clearly and well rounded E and W This one is a 'one' denomination with a lot of hard to count certainly rays THis single has twelve countable rays and four pronged tamghas on each side. While it is not full legend, it shows cleraly sguared E and W letters making it a winner in my book if only fine in grade. This square letter, four denomination has a four prong tamgha on the obverse and three prong reverse. The rays appear to be spaced like a mid number (8-9?) but are too much off center to be a good example. The rest of these followed me home because I liked the style or could count the rays (or they were priced reasonably). Those interested can count and diagnose these but my mind has dropped the theories on mint identification. IMO Soter Megas has some decent coins available to those who can forgive him not writing his name on them. 😀 8 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted October 9, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted October 9, 2022 On 10/6/2022 at 5:22 PM, dougsmit said: There was a period in my collecting where I tried to get interested in Soter Megas and tried to assemble a representative selection. There are two denominations often called drachms and tetradrachms but I might call the units and quarter units not really knowing what the users called them. There were several mints (3 or 4???) often distinguished by style of the lettering. Some used rounded letters (note the W omegas) but can be squared. Sometimes the tamgha on one side or both have four prongs other than the usual three. The coins are dated by the number of rays on the crown BUT it is odd IMO since the earlier ones have the most rays (14???) while later ones go down (to 5???). That means I really did not like coins off center enough to not show countable rays or letters of the ones that were different. The four denomination is not all that easy to find full legend so I compromised and bought the awful obverse to get the full reverse legend. It also shows the weapon/ax of the king clearly and well rounded E and W This one is a 'one' denomination with a lot of hard to count certainly rays THis single has twelve countable rays and four pronged tamghas on each side. While it is not full legend, it shows cleraly sguared E and W letters making it a winner in my book if only fine in grade. This square letter, four denomination has a four prong tamgha on the obverse and three prong reverse. The rays appear to be spaced like a mid number (8-9?) but are too much off center to be a good example. The rest of these followed me home because I liked the style or could count the rays (or they were priced reasonably). Those interested can count and diagnose these but my mind has dropped the theories on mint identification. IMO Soter Megas has some decent coins available to those who can forgive him not writing his name on them. 😀 Very nice selection, the 4-pronged examples are hard to find. I believe there is some recent work claiming that examples with 4 prongs are issues of Kujula Kadphises; as far as I know the argument for that remains unpublished, though, so for now I just consider them all issues of Vima Takto myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsmit Posted October 10, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2022 4 hours ago, velarfricative said: some recent work claiming that examples with 4 prongs are issues of Kujula Kadphises I had not heard that one. It will take some work to convince me that the prongs and letter styles don't indicate mints. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted October 10, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 13 hours ago, dougsmit said: I had not heard that one. It will take some work to convince me that the prongs and letter styles don't indicate mints. I cannot comment on the letter styles, and that may indicate mints; but as for prongs, it's at least plausible that it indicates ruler. Small modifications to the tamgha on the ascension of a new king are standard for all rulers until Vasudeva; the only difference between Kanishka and Huvishka's tamgha is a single crossbar, for instance. The argument would be something along the lines that Kujula Kadphises' tamgha was the 4-pronged one, and Vima's is the 3-pronged one; the mixed issues with both 3- and 4-pronged tamghas could be explained away as transitional. A mix like that would not be unprecedented; early issues of Huvishka use Kanishka's tamgha before eventually switching over. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsmit Posted October 10, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2022 If the 4/3 prongs are transitional, it would seem the obverse rays should all be the same count. Mine is too off center to help. Do you have input on this question? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted October 10, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 4 hours ago, dougsmit said: If the 4/3 prongs are transitional, it would seem the obverse rays should all be the same count. Mine is too off center to help. Do you have input on this question? From the ANS catalogue, coins with a 4-pronged tamgha on either or both sides have either 10, 12, or 13 rays. Nearly all are on issues with the square lettering style, though there are examples with 4 prongs on both sides with cursive lettering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougsmit Posted October 11, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 11, 2022 Has anyone suggested a period where two kings ruled jointly as the case with some Romans? If rays indicated dating as once was the theory and tamgha style indicated ruler, that would seem an answer but I was unaware of that in this culture. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted October 11, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted October 11, 2022 (edited) 8 hours ago, dougsmit said: Has anyone suggested a period where two kings ruled jointly as the case with some Romans? If rays indicated dating as once was the theory and tamgha style indicated ruler, that would seem an answer but I was unaware of that in this culture. It's extremely unlikely, I would think; it contradicts the sources we have, at least. The Chinese account of the rise of the Kushan reads: "Qiujiuque [Kujula Kadphises] was more than eighty years old when he died. His son, Yangaozhen, became king in his place. He defeated Tianzhu [North-western India] and installed Generals to supervise and lead it." The Rabatak inscription also seems to indicate a fairly standard succession. Edited October 11, 2022 by velarfricative 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velarfricative Posted October 11, 2022 · Member Author Share Posted October 11, 2022 The outcomes of the analysis seem to be summarized in this chart Joe Cribb published on Academia: https://www.academia.edu/15209190/The_Soter_Megas_coins_of_the_first_and_second_Kushan_kings_Kujula_Kadphises_and_Wima_Takto Unfortunately, though, to the best of my knowledge the accompanying paper is not online. At the very least, the final page has a fantastic summary of the state of the monetary system in the region over the course of the early Kushan rulers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACCLA-Mike Posted October 11, 2022 · Member Share Posted October 11, 2022 velarfricative, I can send you Joe's paper if you private message me an email address. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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