Benefactor Egry Posted October 18, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted October 18, 2023 It’s been a long time since I posted. But I’ve been lurking and reading posts in the background. Life has been busy, but the best thing about coins is that they will wait for you. I wonder if a new forum topic called Colonial Coins could be added? It is actually one of my favourite areas especially when I need a little break from Roman. Here is my newest addition, such a beauty, and has been on my list for years after I came across one similar but couldn’t afford it at the time. Let me know your thoughts on the coin and also on potentially adding a Colonial Coin section to the forum (wish list only as I obviously have no control over what is on the forum). Spanish Empire, Peru, Philip V of the French House of Bourbon, King of the Spanish Empire in his second reign 1724-1746 AD, Gold Cob Eight Escudos (26.91g, 29mm), 1736 LN, Lima mint. Obverse: Cross of Jerusalem central quartering the field which features the heraldic devices of the Armorial of the Kingdom of Spain, inner beaded border and legend surrounds, “[PHILIPPVS· V· D·G] HISPANI”. Reverse: Pillars of Hercules divides the mark of value “8”, Assayer’s mark “LN” and date “736” (1736), exergual waves below, Royal Crown above, inner beaded border and legend surrounds, “ET· IN[D·….REX· A]NO 736”. KM-38.2; Calico-2151. 12 2 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kali Posted October 18, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 18, 2023 Wow, that is a beauty. Congrats on getting it off the list. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AussieCollector Posted October 18, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 18, 2023 Wow wow wow wow wow! What a coin! Amazing acquisition. This type has been on my list as well, but unlikely I will ever be able to purchase one. I recently picked up a colonial 2 Escudos. Mint: Bogota, Colombia Authority: Phillip IV, assayer A below mintmark NR to left Obverse: full shield with clear (N)RA to left Reverse: full but slightly doubled cross-and-tressure, encrustation in crevices Year: ~1640 Weight: 6.67 grams Catalogue: S-B20; KM-4.1. 9 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPK Posted October 18, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted October 18, 2023 1 hour ago, Egry said: It’s been a long time since I posted. But I’ve been lurking and reading posts in the background. Life has been busy, but the best thing about coins is that they will wait for you. I wonder if a new forum topic called Colonial Coins could be added? It is actually one of my favourite areas especially when I need a little break from Roman. Here is my newest addition, such a beauty, and has been on my list for years after I came across one similar but couldn’t afford it at the time. Let me know your thoughts on the coin and also on potentially adding a Colonial Coin section to the forum (wish list only as I obviously have no control over what is on the forum). Spanish Empire, Peru, Philip V of the French House of Bourbon, King of the Spanish Empire in his second reign 1724-1746 AD, Gold Cob Eight Escudos (26.91g, 29mm), 1736 LN, Lima mint. Obverse: Cross of Jerusalem central quartering the field which features the heraldic devices of the Armorial of the Kingdom of Spain, inner beaded border and legend surrounds, “[PHILIPPVS· V· D·G] HISPANI”. Reverse: Pillars of Hercules divides the mark of value “8”, Assayer’s mark “LN” and date “736” (1736), exergual waves below, Royal Crown above, inner beaded border and legend surrounds, “ET· IN[D·….REX· A]NO 736”. KM-38.2; Calico-2151. Now that is a hunk of gold! 🤯 A stunning example from a fascinating period of history! I also like collecting colonial coinage - mostly British, though I'd love to own a silver 8 reales cob some day! I do have a later, 1798 8-reales coin from the Mexico mint, but I need to take new photos. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 18, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 18, 2023 (edited) I love Spanish gold and silver, this will be a nice addition to the collection I also have many reales but no photos yet. I don’t normally show prices but that’s the only pic I have ($Aud) Edited October 18, 2023 by Egry 8 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GERMANICVS Posted October 19, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 19, 2023 Very nice example of a Lima mint cob 8 Escudos. Very well struck with clear legends and date. I have always wanted one, but they are pricey....... That is also quite the collection of Spanish Milled Colonial gold. Congratulations on assembling that collection. I see Colombia, Spain, Lima and Santiago. The others are probably Mexico? I collect Santiago mint, primarily silver, which is generally much scarcer than the gold from that mint, but also collect some gold. This is my most recent purchase. 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sand Posted October 19, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 19, 2023 (edited) All of the Spanish colonial gold coins, which have been posted in this thread, are very interesting, and quite expensive. I'm quite fascinated with Spanish colonial coins, which were minted in the New World, during the Age Of Exploration. It's interesting, to think of the Spanish ships, sailing on dangerous journeys, across the unknown oceans. And to think of the Spanish explorers, discovering new lands, and discovering unknown civilizations. Here's my oldest Spanish colonial coin, a silver piece of eight from the late 16th century, minted in the New World, approximately 100 years after Columbus discovered the New World. Spain. Philip II. Silver 8 Reales "Piece Of Eight". Minted 1589 AD To 1591 AD. Potosi Mint (In What Is Now Bolivia). Assayer RL. Diameter 37.7 mm. Weight 27.20 grams. Paoletti 97. Sedwick P13. KM 5.1. Edited October 19, 2023 by sand 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 Great coins all! Maybe just maybe we could get our Colonial Coins forum topic. It seems there is a hidden interest among us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 @GERMANICVS Nice acquisition, here is mine from Santiago but just a year earlier. Interesting about this coin (and yours) they both portray the portrait of the previous king but name of the current king. Information moved relatively quickly back then but new dies didn't. Spanish Empire, King Charles III (1759-1788 AD), Gold 8 Escudos (26.79g, 37mm), 1761 So J, Santiago mint, Chile. Obverse: Bare headed and draped Bust of Fernando VI, King of Spain 1746-1759 AD, facing to right, date below bust, legend surrounds, “CAROLUS· III· D·G· HISPAN· ET IND· REX”. Reverse: Crowned Coat of Arms of Spain used in Chile at the time of independence, legend surrounds, “NOMINA MAGNA SEQUOR So J”. KM-20. Some field marks and weak strike across the shield of arms. Details About Extremely Fine. The Obverse Latin legend reads “Carolus Tertius, Deī Grātiā, Hispaniae et Indiae Rex”, with an English translation of “Charles the Third, by the Grace of God, King of Spain and the Indies”. The Reverse Latin legend is stated in full as “Nōmina Magna Sequor”, with an English translation “I/We Follow the Great Name”. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 Here one of my favourite Spanish silver coins, this one minted in Mexico. I think my favourite part about old Spanish colonial coins would have to be the Pillars of Hercules, they must have symbolised wonder and adventure to those in Europe at the time. Spanish Colonial. Carlos I and Juana AR 4 Reales. Ciudad de México (Mexico City) mint, 1542-1555. [CAROLVS] ⵓ ET ⵓ IOH[AN]A ⵓ RGS, coat of arms; mintmark across fields / [+] HISPANIARV[M ⵓ E]T ⵓ INDI[ARVM], two crowned pillars on the sea, PLV-S VL-TR between; 4 below. AC 138; MB 18. 13.38g, 32mm, 9h. Very Fine. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GERMANICVS Posted October 19, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 19, 2023 When I see Spanish Colonial coins, this is one image which comes to mind: So much of the gold and silver plundered from the New World never made it back to Spain. The 8 escudos coin I am attaching was bought at Sotheby's 1993 sale of treasure recovered from the spanish merchant ship Nuestra Senora De La Luz. The ship sank off Montevideo on the estuary of the Rio de la Plata, probably in 1752. My coin still show marine deposits accumulated after two and a half centuries at the bottom of the sea. Like most of the coins recovered, this 8 escudos was struck at the newly opened mint at Santiago, capital of the Capitania General de Chile 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 Wow! That is a beauty. I wonder if there has ever been a calculation or estimate of gold minted in the new world vs what lays at the bottom of the ocean? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GERMANICVS Posted October 19, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 19, 2023 4 minutes ago, Egry said: Wow! That is a beauty. I wonder if there has ever been a calculation or estimate of gold minted in the new world vs what lays at the bottom of the ocean? I came upon such an estimate some years ago ( but I do not recall where i found it). The estimate was that up to 1/3 of the gold, silver, and other valuable which the Spanish took from their colonial possesions never made it back to Spain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 (edited) I have a couple Spanish reale coins that have obvious salt damage likely from a wreck, but no way of identifying which one. Here is my only shipwreck coin of which the wreck is known. Recovered off of the Western Australian Coast in 1963 by a diver in the Explorers Club of WA. It is from the Vergulde Draeck (Gilt Dragon) which was a VOC ship that in 1656 struck a reef off the Coast of Australia and sunk. Some of the crew made it to shore. The current suburbs in the area are named after the local aboriginal place names, which oddly are very similar to old Dutch words with the same translations. Edited October 20, 2023 by Egry Mistakenly said ‘Spanish shipwreck’ it’s a Spanish coin from a Dutch shipwreck 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 5 minutes ago, GERMANICVS said: I came upon such an estimate some years ago ( but I do not recall where i found it). The estimate was that up to 1/3 of the gold, silver, and other valuable which the Spanish took from their colonial possesions never made it back to Spain. That would make complete sense. I’ve sailed a bit (not a lot) and one key element is closely watching the forecast and winds, even then you can still get caught in an unpredictable situation. Sailing back then would be like rolling the dice, and based on your stat it was a 3 sided dice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Egry Posted October 19, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted October 19, 2023 2 hours ago, GERMANICVS said: Very nice example of a Lima mint cob 8 Escudos. Very well struck with clear legends and date. I have always wanted one, but they are pricey....... That is also quite the collection of Spanish Milled Colonial gold. Congratulations on assembling that collection. I see Colombia, Spain, Lima and Santiago. The others are probably Mexico? I collect Santiago mint, primarily silver, which is generally much scarcer than the gold from that mint, but also collect some gold. This is my most recent purchase. Most of my milled Escudos are from Columbia , Bolivia, Chile, with a couple from Spain. Actually not one from Mexico. I just realized that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GERMANICVS Posted October 20, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 20, 2023 11 hours ago, Egry said: That would make complete sense. I’ve sailed a bit (not a lot) and one key element is closely watching the forecast and winds, even then you can still get caught in an unpredictable situation. Sailing back then would be like rolling the dice, and based on your stat it was a 3 sided dice. I wonder what it must have been like for Spanish galleons to sail around the Cabo de Hornos, at the southern tip of South America. I have never been there but have read enough to know it can be a frightful experience even for modern day vessels - now imagine a creaking old galleon.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisB Posted October 20, 2023 · Patron Share Posted October 20, 2023 Here are my only pieces of Spanish empire gold. Colombia 1794 8 Escudos Peru 1782 8 Escudos And this one is a bit later but still cool. Chile 1845 8 Escudos 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AussieCollector Posted October 21, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 21, 2023 This is my kind of thread. I love Spanish colonial coins. I especially love cob coins - there is something romantic about their crudeness and rugged beauty. Here is my collection of Spanish colonial cobs (other than the one posted above): 4 Reales Mexico City, Mexico Charles-Joanna, "Late Series". Assayer G to right, mintmark M to left (M-G). King's name as CHAROLVS. Nesmith-50f type. 13.57 grams. 2 Escudos Seville, Spain Gold cob. Philip II or Philip III. Assayer and mintmark not visible. Full cross. Shield crudely struck. 6.74g 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AussieCollector Posted October 21, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 21, 2023 8 Reales Potosi, (1)666, Pillar and Waves type 8 Reales Potosi (1)704 Pillar and Waves type 8 Reales Mexico (171(0)(J) 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panzerman Posted October 21, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 21, 2023 Beautifull addition! I also love Colonial coins/ esp. Spanish/ Portuguese gold. 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted October 21, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted October 21, 2023 Wonderful coins posted! I think a forum devoted to Spanish colonial and mainland coinage would be a great addition to Numisforums. There's such an abundance of types and periods, to say not to mention the history behind these coins. I had a thread relatively early on in the history of Numisforums that focused on cob coinage. At the time there didn't seem to be much of a response. Now, a year or two later there are more members who specialize or at least collect some Spanish coinage, so as the base grows I am sure there are many who would love to share their coins as well as information and questions. Before hitting the reset button on my collecting habits back around 2019, I concentrated on Spanish colonial, Spanish mainland (to a much lesser degree) and Latin American republican coinage. I have lots of coins that need photographing and research. Perhaps I will be more motivated (I'm hardly what you'd call a "self starter) and begin to do this long overdue task. Colombia, 8 reales, Philip IV, Bogota, 1660s, PoRS NR. Acquired from Superior Auctions. 27.1 grams 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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