Prieure de Sion Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 RÖMISCHE REPUBLIK NACH 211 V. CHR. Sextus Pompeius Fostlus, 137 v. Chr. Sextus Pompeius Fostlus, 137 v. Chr. Denar ø 19mm (3.91g). Mzst.Rom. Vs.: Kopf der Roma mit geflügeltem Helm n. r., dahinter Krug, davor X. Rs.: SEX POM / FOSTLVS / ROMA, Lupa Romana mit Romulus u. Remus, dahinter Ficus Ruminalis mit drei Vögeln, l. Faustulus mit Hirtenstab. Cr. 235/1a; Syd. 461. Herrliche Tönung, vz See here: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/gornymosch/browse?a=3861&l=4504640 Sold: 2.200 Euro ---- Did I miss something? Am I not seeing something? The type is generally often highly priced - but I know prices around 500/800 euros for this type when it is in very good condition. Yes the coin in the auction is very well preserved, excellent - but 2,200 euros plus surcharge - so around 2,700 euros! Can someone please help me? I don't see any special provinence. I don't see a rare variant. Why this price? 5 2 1 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesiod Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 When two whales want a coin really badly... I have the same reaction about the kroton stater (https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=7084&lot=1033) going for 13k 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Anthos Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 Some people just have more dollars than sense. ~ Peter 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salomons Cat Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 (edited) I must say that I‘m not soo surprised. This denarius is the most beautiful one among the ~98 examples on acsearch. Of course that‘s expensive, but I don’t think that the price is completely irrational. At least not if you‘re very, very rich. Edited October 10, 2023 by Salomons Cat 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennos Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 43 minutes ago, Hesiod said: When two whales want a coin really badly... I have the same reaction about the kroton stater (https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=7084&lot=1033) going for 13k yes, I don't understand the irrational price increase on these kroton staters in recent sales. The same goes for Agathocles tetradrachms over the last three years... 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Phil Davis Posted October 10, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted October 10, 2023 2 hours ago, Prieure de Sion said: RÖMISCHE REPUBLIK NACH 211 V. CHR. Sextus Pompeius Fostlus, 137 v. Chr. Sextus Pompeius Fostlus, 137 v. Chr. Denar ø 19mm (3.91g). Mzst.Rom. Vs.: Kopf der Roma mit geflügeltem Helm n. r., dahinter Krug, davor X. Rs.: SEX POM / FOSTLVS / ROMA, Lupa Romana mit Romulus u. Remus, dahinter Ficus Ruminalis mit drei Vögeln, l. Faustulus mit Hirtenstab. Cr. 235/1a; Syd. 461. Herrliche Tönung, vz See here: https://www.biddr.com/auctions/gornymosch/browse?a=3861&l=4504640 Sold: 2.200 Euro ---- Did I miss something? Am I not seeing something? The type is generally often highly priced - but I know prices around 500/800 euros for this type when it is in very good condition. Yes the coin in the auction is very well preserved, excellent - but 2,200 euros plus surcharge - so around 2,700 euros! Can someone please help me? I don't see any special provinence. I don't see a rare variant. Why this price? That price is strong certainly, but neither surprising nor unreasonable. Earlier this year, I won the following coin in Roma at a hammer of 1200 GBP. (Different variety, but that doesn't affect the price much on this issue.) To be sure, I paid significantly less than the G&M winner, but well above your suggested 500/800 euro range. Was that also "too much" in your view? As the Roma catalogue says, my coin is "uncommonly complete for the issue", which is why I opted for it, but the G&M coin clearly has better detail in the wolf. I can easily understand that being of overriding importance for a sophisticated bidder. I see no reason to doubt that the G&M bidder bid knowingly with their eyes wide open, on a coin they badly wanted. Presumably, the underbidder did as well. 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor DonnaML Posted October 10, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted October 10, 2023 I would have thought that anyone paying that much for an example of this type would at least want one with the legend on the reverse entirely on the flan and readable. Which it certainly isn't on the Gorny & Mosch specimen. On the other hand, I can't say I've ever seen one for which that's true (although @Phil Davis's comes closer, and I like it better), and sometimes people don't care about legends as long as the design is completely visible. And 2,200 Euros to some people is like a dollar to me! Still, I see it as one of those overcrowded Roman Republican coin designs (sort of like the Aemilius Scaurus & Plautius Hypsaeus camel design), and I've never tried to buy either type. I don't think I'd pay 2,200 Euros for that particular specimen even if I were a billionaire! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor Phil Davis Posted October 10, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted October 10, 2023 The coin I posted above is the only one of the three varieties of this type I own. I waited and waited, passing up some really sharp, well-struck examples, for precisely the reason you cite: full legends. I've reluctantly come to the conclusion that this type with truly complete legends simply doesn't exist and never did. I agree with your last point; I wouldn't put the OP example in my collection for any price. As you also said though, not everyone cares very much about the legends. For collectors with that view--no value judgement implied--the OP coin is exceptional. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salomons Cat Posted October 10, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 10, 2023 (edited) 21 hours ago, DonnaML said: I would have thought that anyone paying that much for an example of this type would at least want one with the legend on the reverse entirely on the flan and readable. Which it certainly isn't on the Gorny & Mosch specimen. On the other hand, I can't say I've ever seen one for which that's true (although @Phil Davis's comes closer, and I like it better), and sometimes people don't care about legends as long as the design is completely visible. And 2,200 Euros to some people is like a dollar to me! Still, I see it as one of those overcrowded Roman Republican coin designs (sort of like the Aemilius Scaurus & Plautius Hypsaeus camel design), and I've never tried to buy either type. I don't think I'd pay 2,200 Euros for that particular specimen even if I were a billionaire! I envision a scenario where a millionaire or billionaire, after enjoying a few glasses of wine in the evening, shares his coin collection with friends who aren't collectors. He begins by recounting the foundation myth of Rome, starting with this coin, primarily focusing on the image on the reverse. He would say: „This coin features one of the earliest portrayals of the she-wolf alongside Romulus and Remus, at 137 BC…“. The audience would be fascinated and the legends would go unread, anyway. That‘s how I imagine it. Another scenario would be a collector who has all of his coins in XF condition - and for this coin, such a specimen is just very hard to find. That‘s why he needed this one. In this case, the general condition would be more important than the completeness of the legends. All in all, I could imagine a few reasons why someone could have wanted exactly this coin. Edited October 11, 2023 by Salomons Cat 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartolus Posted October 13, 2023 · Member Share Posted October 13, 2023 On 10/10/2023 at 10:33 PM, DonnaML said: I would have thought that anyone paying that much for an example of this type would at least want one with the legend on the reverse entirely on the flan and readable. Which it certainly isn't on the Gorny & Mosch specimen. On the other hand, I can't say I've ever seen one for which that's true (although @Phil Davis's comes closer, and I like it better), and sometimes people don't care about legends as long as the design is completely visible. And 2,200 Euros to some people is like a dollar to me! Still, I see it as one of those overcrowded Roman Republican coin designs (sort of like the Aemilius Scaurus & Plautius Hypsaeus camel design), and I've never tried to buy either type. I don't think I'd pay 2,200 Euros for that particular specimen even if I were a billionaire! As Phil Davis has already pointed out, it is almost impossible to find specimens of this coin with the legend entirely readable. This perhaps comes close to meeting the requirement: ROMA in the exergue, FOSTLUS in the left field and SEX . PO on the right are entirely readable and only the O of PO is half out of the field. The woodpecker on the 'ficus ruminalis' is also outlined very well. 7 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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