Rand

There are so many exceptional coins on this thread! Forgive me for my ignorance. For the types with serrated edges, were all coins made serrated, or there were both serrated and smooth-edged coins within the same type?

Thank you, Al Kowsky. The Mare Nostrum Hoard is hugely important and, being at all probability completed around 493, has beautiful rare Anastasian coins and many very nice and rare Zeno (Odovacer/Visighoths, etc) coins. It is still being sold. I have bought a few of Anastasian coins - bidding gets heated for better coins, and I am sure I will be at a loss if I sell. At auction XXVIII, Roma stopped identifying coins from the hoard, but they can be identified by style across Roman, Migration periods and Byzantine coins. It has not been published, and I cannot see any insensitive for Roma to do so now. My count shows 274 sold from 426 reported by Roma before the initial sale. So there are about 150 coins to go unless some are sold privately - I will cry if I cannot see them all. I am not even worried about the exact find spot (likely in water) as the content tells enough. I just want to see them all. During the last Roma auction, I noticed heavy bidding from the US, so the buyers must be confident of the legitimate provenance. Shanna Schmidt re-sells some of them (including at Vcoins).

Indeed, the attribution is uncertain, and the next find can change it. I do not follow Odovacer’s ‘Zeno’ coins very closely. However, the candidates for key Italian mints are plentiful, and the evolution of their productions starts taking shape: Rome coins are neat, and those from other mints are of increasingly crude style. Your coin is outside the common ‘crudeness’ of later Odovacer’s coins and of rather nice style. The shape of the hand holding the spear and the style of the ‘wave and dots’ pattern on the vertical and horizontal bands do have a likeness to the later ‘Burgundian’ coins. This is a link to the ANS coin with the same ‘Officina I’ as yours. http://numismatics.org/collection/1944.100.84986?lang=en The havoc of the Theoderic Italian wars disrupted minting in Milan (which was destroyed) and Ravenna (experienced a lengthy siege) and influenced others outside. Piecing them together is hard, and every unusual coin counts. I recently bought a Zeno Constantinople coin linked die-link to Anastasius (in a museum collection) - I only wish the same for Western types. NB. Burgundian’ coins are at a premium to most Italian coins of Anastasius and maybe even more so for Zeno! The other coin is also interesting. Again, I do not know them well, but I can match them to the Anastasian series of both Imperial and Italian styles.

I do not know the details of Greek law, but I doubt it is specific where the coins owned by the state are stored or displayed. It might be legit to pass the Eid Mar aureus to a distinguished individual for 'storage' and 'public engagement', such as showing off at parties.

This is a very nice and numismatically interesting coin. It may be linked to the scarce but likely substantial issue of Anastasius below and helps date the issue to the late Zeno's and early Anastasius's reigns. For proof the link misses an ANASTASIVS PERP (491-492) transitional type - I hope it appears. If the link is correct, the issue is related to the conduct and spoils of the 489-493 Theodoric’s conquest of Italy from Odovacer. I know 16 Anastasius coins of this type from 11 obverse and reverse dies with 35 predicted dies (700,000 coins if 20,000 coins were minted using a die pair). Fritz Rudolf Künker GmbH & Co. KG. Auction 304. 19/03/2018 The solidi were produced with three 'officinae' marks: A, Ǝ, and I. Their good style and 'officinae' may link them to good style VPW tremisses, which also used A, Ǝ, I 'officinae'. If correct, this helps to date these tremisses. Gorny & Mosch Giessener Münzhandlung. Auction 228. 09/03/2015. The later evolution of the solidi is not very clear. They have been followed by a small issue of the coins below, of which I only know 3 coins from 3 different die pairs. Their later issue is supported by using longer spears that break the legend and eventually nearly reach the rim. This development is well observed on Visigothic solidi and is typical of later Anastasian coins in Gaul. Classical Numismatic Group, Inc. Triton XXIV. 19/01/2021. The issue seems to be completed by a single coin (which I do not own) of a more 'barbaric' style, which may be due to the minting city being affected by one of the numerous wars of the period. The 'barbarous' style of the last coin may indicate a takeover by Franks as Burgundians and Visigoths produced coins of good style during the early Anastasian period. These coins are often attributed to Burgundians. Perhaps so. Both Visigoths and Burgundians were active during the Theodoric's war. They should have had a considerable amount of gold to produce the coins, Visigoths as payment for supporting Theodoric and Burgundians from spoils of invading Liguria and later from ransom paid by Theodoric for the prisoners being returned to Italy. Clovis's Francs were unlikely to be the issuers as they took advantage of the war by attacking the north of the Visigothic realm and other campaigns in the north. Visigoths produced differen rather well-defined coin series, which leaves Burgundians likely candidates. If so, which of the Burgundian princes minted them, Gundobad in Lyon, Chilperic II in Valence, or Godegisel in Geneva? The good style makes it more likely by an established mint of Lyon. In this case, the last ‘barbaric’ coin could be minted during the year 500 war when Clovis chased Gundobad down to Avignon. Sadly, there are too few finds recorded. Solidi: Rhenen find, Utrecht, Netherlands, now in the National Museum of Antiquities in Leiden. Lenormant does not record the source of the coin know to him, but he typically published coins found in France (Lenormant C. Lettres à M. de Saulcy sur les plus anciens monuments numismatiques de la série mérovingienne. Revue Numismatique. 1853. pp. 99-139; 277-316.) Tremisses: Two in the 1845 Gourdon Hoard hoard Tow in the 1804 Alise-Saint-Reine (Alesia) Hoard This might support the Burgundian origin, but both hoards were buried much later - after the Anastasius reign. PS. Everything above are only my speculations!

Interesting. There may be some value thresholds? The pattern was different for lower value items (banknotes, which I sold off later). DHL has been my firm favourite. Parcerlforce - I am dealing with them even today, to get refund for the last MDC sale delivery. PS. I also want to avoid ending up not paying the due Import VAT. If the postage company does not do this, the buyer still has the legal duty to pay (I understand). The previous low-value banknotes were mainly from eBay, which charged 20% tax during purchase (annoying, but too much hassle to deal with!). Usually, there was no additional tax on delivery. I collected them to fill in the buying urge, but eventually, they became a distractor, with too many of them and gradually slipping to more expensive items.

In the UK, there is a 5% Import VAT on numismatic items (plus £12-14 handling fees), which is fair. It is annoying when a delivery invoice shows 20%. Paying it is the only option (or the coins are sent back). The refund process from HMRC is robust but requires extra time filling out a form, printing it, and posting it with evidence. My experience of wrong Import VAT added: Parcelforce: always FedEx: often DHL: uncommon I tried contacting PacelForce once to correct the invoice - they refused.

@Kaleun96 On reflection, I retract my 'I suspect most coins people try to smuggle from Turkey and Greece are incidental finds, often on their own land.'. There was a clear spike in coin finds since metal detecting became widespread in the UK and elsewhere, and finds by metal detecting are deliberate rather than incidental. Even if metal detecting is less common (or prohibited) in Greece and Turkey, illegal searchers use it. Still, if Google's translation from Greek is any good, the linked articles are not convincing that large-scale looting is a major problem in Greece. One article repeats the known Eid Mar aureus story; the other refers to a trial that has yet to be completed (if understood correctly). The trial case refers to 2,024 coins confiscated by authorities and 600 coins repatriated from Munich during the investigation started in 2015. It would be interesting to know how many coins reached the Archeological Museum in Athens over the same period for comparison.

Not at all! A very interesting discussion. I may sound like a Looter's Advocate, which I am not at all - I do agree with your reasoning! It just helps to consider the perspectives of different parties involved.

I suspect most coins people try to smuggle from Turkey and Greece are incidental finds, often on their own land. What options do people have? - To give the coins to authorities. I have heard this may put people into trouble as they may be suspected of not returning all coins and investigated. - To keep them. From Greek friends, I have heard that many families keep ancient coins they found (which could be a long time ago). - To try selling the coins, feeling it is unfair for the governments to take away from them what they found on their own land, especially if they struggle financially, and they approach grey dealers. These people may not see it as looting and organised crime, but governments may.

Some news from CoinsWeekly on the resistance from the US collector community/trade to the repatriation practice. https://new.coinsweekly.com/news/customs-repatriation-to-greece-raises-questions/ I am still waiting for a celebratory update from the Greek or Turkish recipients of the Eid Mar aureus, with new high-quality photos, information about the find spot/provenance and public access to the coin. They have kept a low profile so far.

It is an excellent video of a great collector and numismatist. I did not know who BCD was before this video, and I really liked his personality presented in the video. During a discussion towards the end of the video regarding a less appropriate request to access his library, BCD asks, ‘Do you know how to do research on auction catalogues?’ If addressed to me, the frank answer would be, ‘No, I do not’. Any advice on where can I find this out? Any advice on best practices for getting great scans/images of catalogue plates (as opposed to photos of coins)? Much appreciated.

One day same may happen to comic books and baseball cards. It may be time to implement their cultural protection status, introduce export restrictions and measures to prevent their use in illicit trade (I am sarcastic this time). I would not be surprised if their museum expositions attract more attention than those of ancient coins.

An unfortunate transatlantic ripple? In their auction this week, Roma stopped specifying which coins were from The Mare Nostrum hoard, one of the most important hoards ever from the period. I do respect however the American public feels about what coins should or should not be hosted by their country. I am worried about the possible loss of records about finds and damage to the knowledge of history.

Museum numismatic exhibitions and collections could be an interesting topic for a thread.

A publication has been in my mind from start (~15 years ago), but it will not happen any time soon (or at all if done by others). I have plenty of material to publish 'something', but I do not feel it is ready for a meaningful analysis that advances numismatic and historical fields. The dataset is far from complete: I am ploughing through old catalogues. Fortunately, more appear online. I hope to spend a holiday or two in Fitzwilliam Museum (if allowed) going through the 40,000 catalogues in their collection. I need access to local museums (especially in France and North Italy) and some bigger museum collections. Coins in local museums are more likely to be from local finds - my best hope to fill gaps in the 'barbarian' series. Mostly, I have no reply from museums or a kind of 'go away' reply. I hope to travel to small museums taking photos and coin records. I tested Musée des Antiquités in Rouen a few weeks ago during a family holiday. It shoud have a tremissis from Nesle-Hodeng find reported by Jean Lafaurie in ‘Trouvailles de monnaies franques et mérovingiennes en Seine-Maritime (Ve-VIIIe siècles)', 1980. I hoped to get a better quality of the pictured photo of the coin and see what else they have. The museum has not replied to my email. The numismatic collection is part of the museum's online advertisement, so I went there anyway. On visiting them, I was told that I could not access coins not on display. The displayed collection (except several French coins) is shown below. I need a better strategy for approaching museums, perhaps learning some French or finding a way of introduction. Some museums might expect non-official insensitive/fees, but I am naive about the traditions. I need to learn quality coin photography! I learnt a lot from the thread by @Kaleun96 However, I need to make the set portable (e.g., Keiser has a portable copy stand). I fear getting museum permissions will be challenging. I may end up using an iPhone, which is far from ideal. I had to learn about data management, which has been mostly sorted. I am still cracking automatic visualisations of die-links in chronological order. Doing this manually is a pain, even for smaller series. Lots of rearrangements are needed when new dies appear, especially when multiple officinas shared dies. I have to complete finds records. I have records of 177 hoards and single finds that included Anastasian gold, but many miss photos or have poor quality photos. I recently updated this section so it links directly with coin records, die records, publications, etc. Still a lot of work to do. It is exciting to trace the movements of coins from particular series, possibly suggesting their intended minting and distributions (e.g., to support Ostrogoths fighting in Italy with Odovacer). Getting the historical perspective has been relatively easy. There are few contemporary or soon-after records. Those surviving have been well published and discussed. Coins are one of the significant records of the period! I particularly enjoy mapping the military campaign movements of the Franks and Burgundians (if I am correct in interpreting letters on their coins). The gold used has different shades, with likely different metal compositions of non-imperial series. I am happy to offer my collection for analyses as soon as they are none-disctructive. I aimed to get representative coins from different mints/denominations. I have a few same-die duplicates,and triplicates for validation work, and die-linked coins. The British Museum has the world's biggest collection of Anastasian gold coins, nearly twice bigger than mine (and I may not even know about some). However, their permissions to move coins for analysis could be prohibitive. I have started discussions with numismatic academia. I shall see what happens. Irrespective of the results, it is rewarding enough to discover old secrets! However, a publication would need to be done with academic input, leaving my fantasies to me and facts for sharing. From Jean Lafaurie. ‘Trouvailles de monnaies franques et mérovingiennes en Seine-Maritime (Ve-VIIIe siècles)', 1980. Numismatic collection on display in Musée des Antiquités in Rouen (except a small display of French coins, 1520-1590).

@John Conduitt. I cannot say whether Anastasius is more or less popular among forgers than other rulers of the period. My speculations about possible popularity are: Anastasian gold is generally popular as inexpensive 'ancient gold' from the first Byzantium emperor. The designs are not sophisticated. There are many variations of genuine coins, with solidi widely copied around Europe by emerging 'Barbaric' states - some deviations from originals are easy to overlook. These coins are relatively inexpensive with little financial loss over the bullion value to make hassle arguing with dealers and for dealers to be too much of a concern. As I mentioned on another thread, a more expensive suspected Anastasius fake appeared a few years ago (I am aware of 14 copies with their sale prices declining as they kept appearing). I no longer see them in trade. Those coins have never been officially listed as 'fake' on open registries. The sale price must still be sufficient to justify their production. Most common fakes were produced in quantities from the 60th and were common in auction catalogues of the 60th-70th. I do not know if they are still produced or recycled. There are many Anastasian gold coins! For 2020, I have 504 new entries (352 solidi, 14 semisses, and 138 tremisses), but a few are from museums. So, c. 400 Anastasian gold coins are sold yearly (the number seems to keep increasing). Twenty fake coins make 5%. I have records of fake 74 solidi and 53 tremisses, with many sold several times. I have records of perhaps 20+ further 'unsorted' fake coins. This is less than 5% of all Anastasian gold coins in private hands. However, some tend to be seen on offer from year to year, possibly recognised as such and harder to sell.

In the niche area, I am most interested (Anastasian gold) common fakes make up 5-10% (varies from year to year) of coins sold through NumisBids, Biddr, Sixbid, MA-Shops and Vcoins and without considering Ebay. There are a few other coins that look suspicious and may be fakes, and I am unsure about a couple of my coins. Sadly, the information on more recent and dangerous fakes is hard to find. I hope the trade industry and NGC conduct internal research and have methods to identify modern fakes while keeping them secrete to avoid informing fakers. I fear being disillusioned about this. Pre-sixties provenances are a valuable source of information in the field.

I wonder if accurate detection and description of coin manipulations are within the expertise of many dealers. I went through Russian coins last night, looking into the latest Roma offering. Very few early silvers are free of tooling/repair … when coins are NGC graded. I do not like NGC slabs, bulky and ugly. However, I would prefer any coin sold for $5K+ to be independently graded - not for the sake of a super high grade, but to know the coins are in their original state. I admit I cannot decide what cleaning level is acceptable for bronze coins. This is easier for gold and silver.

Phocas, Issue 607-610. Solidus. Officina 8. 4.48 g. Numismatica Ars Classica. Auction 56. 08/10/2010.

Maurice Tiberius. Struck 583/4-602. Solidus. 19 mm, 4.39 g. Constantinople mint, 8th officina. Classical Numismatic Group, Inc. Auction 93. 22/05/2013

Justin II. 565-578. Solidus. 4.42 g. Thessalonica mint. CNG puts 'Struck circa 570.', but I could not find a good reason for the date. These Thessalonica solidi are too scarce to be produced during the whole reign. It would be interesting to know when and why the mint produced them. Classical Numismatic Group, Inc. Auction 93. 22/05/2013

Just got a response from the ANS, which was fast, friendly and appropriate, with further review requested. ‘Thank you for reaching out, and not a bother at all! I’ve just been able to inspect our coin in person, and I feel fairly confident that the ANS specimen is not struck from the same dies as the published fake you provided, but as I am by no means an expert in Byzantine coinage, I have added a note to our internal database with information re: this known fake for further Curatorial review.’

Apologies, I keep editing my statement as it still does not read very clearly. Their information is sufficient for me to decide not to bid on these coins. Also, the repairs are not 'minor' from my point of view.

As for me, this is enough. It is tooled so firmly out of the bidding list. Very likely, NCG would not grade them.