Defend it….

[maridvnvm]

Tooling has been discussed here a few times. There was a thread here where we discussed some before and after images that some found educational.

https://www.numisforums.com/topic/4191-tooling-thoughts/

[Tejas]

I wished auction houses and dealers would treat tooled coins like modern forgeries. I know, the problem is where to draw a line. But perhaps this is not so difficult. As soon as a coin needs to be described as “tooled” (or similar) it should in my view not be resold. Maybe this would end the egregious praxis of engraving ancient coins.

[Octavius]

10 hours ago, robinjojo said:

'Tis a well traveled path my friends.  I could use a little smoothing and tooling but I don't think Medicare or Kaiser covers that!

With ancients I see the issue as a matter of degree, since virtually all have been "processed" in one way or another.  I think the full disclosure of the sestertius's condition is laudatory and something that I wished many other dealers and auction houses would use as a model. 

I agree tooling should be mentioned and most of all , should never be called "enhanced". Sometimes I think we bring our conceptions of modern coins with us to this hobby. A cleaned ancient is not the same as a cleaned modern coin. Collectors just would not buy ancient coins covered in debris and corrosion unless they happen to enjoy cleaning them themselves.

As for this seller, Prieure, I have purchased several coins from him in the past , and hope to do so again in the future. I can attest that he is of the highest ethical standard, honest, and just great to do business with.

[DonnaML]

Some of you might find it interesting to read the views of one dealer on acceptable vs. unacceptable practices with respect to painting/repatination, smoothing and tooling, etc., using Judaean coins as an example. It's on the defunct website of Fontanille Coins -- a once well-known and reputable dealer, apparently -- so the link is through the Wayback Machine: https://web.archive.org/web/20190915164751/http://www.fontanillecoins.com/tooling.htm.

In general, he views cleaning and what he calls "repatination" as acceptable, and tooling (beyond mere smoothing of the fields) as unacceptable. Here is one of his statements:

"Repatination is an improper word that does not consist in removing the original patina in order to replace it by a new and thus fake one. It simply consists, after a coin has been cleaned, in adding a layer of bright substance in the background in order to enhance the patterns. The silver coins do not need repatination because they are naturally bright, but the bronze coins, when cleaned, are generally covered by a dark patina and they need repatination."

It would seem that as long as the repatination is removable, it's OK in his view. So he would probably endorse adding "desert patina" like a certain dealer named "A." does. He also seems to think some smoothing is OK -- but not tooling.

Here are links to two threads on the FORVM discussion boards commenting on Fontanille's views, one from 2013 and one from 2015:

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=91927.msg573789#msg573789

https://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=101965.msg628053#msg628053

As far as I'm concerned, so long as what somebody does to a coin beyond cleaning is removable and disclosed, it becomes a matter of taste as to whether it increases or decreases the value, and whether it's acceptable or unacceptable. Personally, it's not to my taste. I don't like the way applied desert patina looks -- perhaps because it's so strongly associated in my mind with "fakeness." So I wouldn't buy a desert patina coin from "A.", disclosed or otherwise. And I don't like "painted" coins either. But at least processes like that can be reversed.

Smoothing of the fields of bronze coins also doesn't bother me that much, as long as it doesn't touch the actual devices (if I'm using that word correctly) or legends on the coin. In any event, it's such a common process that I'm sure I've bought coins that are smoothed. 

As far as I'm concerned, though, actual tooling (re-engraving) of the designs or lettering on ancient coins transforms the coin so much that it's no longer an actual "ancient" coin in any genuine sense. It may be attractive as an objet d'art, but it might as well be a restrike or reproduction, even though it's on the original flan. It's no more the original coin than a "hobo nickel" is the original nickel.

I'm not sure I agree with the author of the essay on Fontanille Coins that smoothing by itself is a type of tooling. I view them as fundamentally different in kind as well as in degree.

As far as I know, tooling is not so easy and not so much a concern with silver denarii and antoninianii, which is one of the reasons I focus more on such coins in buying Roman Imperials, and avoid bronzes unless they're from a dealer whom I trust to recognize and disclose tooling.

Edited December 19, 2023 by DonnaML

[Heliodromus]

Of course real repatination  - stripping and repatinating - does exist too. A couple of years ago Naumann was selling a bunch of coins that had been stripped and "repatinated" in some ghastly way. The "patina" (or whatever the right word might be) literally stunk (smelled bad) and would come off very easily with a little acetone. To make matters worse many of the coins must have been sitting together in this smelly soup since many had BD that appeared shortly after. I'm not sure that in this case the fact that the fake patina was removable is of much comfort since what was underneath was a shiny metal stripped coin, not any kind of original surface.

I'm not sure that all such fake patinas are reversible though, since some such as CNGs infamous "brown surfaces" seem very stable, and may well have been the result of a chemical reaction with the coin's surface, not something painted on. I wonder if these were stripped beforehand too - hard to imagine getting a totally uniform surface if adding patina on top of something else that can't have looked great (else why repatinate?).

 

Edited December 19, 2023 by Heliodromus