Today's Roma auction of Byzantine coins - how did you do?

[robinjojo]

Did anyone have any luck bidding in today's auction at Roma?   There were some pretty rare coins included in the sale, some of which I have not seen before, such as the follis minted in Sardinia.  I was successful with two bids, one costing me quite dearly, lot 7, a follis of Justin I and Justinian I, Constantinople, and the other a follis of Justinian I, Rome, lot 38.  I'll post both coins when they arrive.

[kirispupis]

I don't collect Byzantines, so I didn't bid, but I may be getting a bit tired of Roma.

Of all the auctions, they seem to be the ones I need to bid the most dearly at to have a chance of winning. Even then they lead all houses (except for the weird Nomos where one Chinese bidder picked up almost the entire collection) in ridiculous bids. I'm not sure why bids there seem to be more aggressive than any other house, but I've tapered back the coins I intend to bid on at their next auction and I'm leaning toward putting only market bids in for coins, since even those I'm interested in at this auction have appeared at other houses.

[robinjojo]

Yes, I've found bidding quite aggressive for some lots.  With these Byzantine bronze coins, especially those from outlying mints (Rome, Carthage, Syracuse/Sicily, Ravenna, etc., I find it hard to gage rarity since, in my experience, there are some coins that I have rarely seen.  So, in the case of these coins I can see the spirited bidding, driven I imagine by some pretty advanced collectors.  But Roma, with the 22.5% buyer's fee, plus a surging British pound, does make acquisitions, even for "reasonably" hammer price coins, more expensive.

I as mentioned, I went a bit overboard with lot 7, but in my case I've been looking for a mate for my Antioch follis of Justin I and Justinian I.  The coin in lot 7 was graded by Roma as a VF, I suppose that's correct, but the strike is very nice, with full legend on the obverse, a good portrait, for the period, and with most of the reverse detail present made this an attractive and rare coin for me, so I bit the bullet. 

For the Rome follis of Justinian I, there were multiple lots offered.  I've been looking for a type follis from this ephemeral mint, so I opted a coin in the middle of the pack, with a nice obverse and typically crude reverse. 

The Byzantine coins aside, the Greek coins auctioned by Roma, at least in their e-auctions, seem to have trended up (insofar as I track trends, which I don't really).  That said, the costs for me have increased.  Other auction houses, such as CNG charge Californian sales tax, as they must, but they also charge a 2.5% fee for credit card transactions, another cost.  Nowhere to go, nowhere to hide in my case.

I think, assuming that auction trends continue as they are currently, other venues such as VCoins do seem more viable and affordable.

[AussieCollector]

I bid on a few coins, but was outbid.

Like others, I have found Roma to be increasingly expensive.

It was never cheap, but it has been getting worse. I used to accept this given their reputation, but they don't even have that anymore.

[kirispupis]

3 hours ago, robinjojo said:

Yes, I've found bidding quite aggressive for some lots.  With these Byzantine bronze coins, especially those from outlying mints (Rome, Carthage, Syracuse/Sicily, Ravenna, etc., I find it hard to gage rarity since, in my experience, there are some coins that I have rarely seen.  So, in the case of these coins I can see the spirited bidding, driven I imagine by some pretty advanced collectors.  But Roma, with the 22.5% buyer's fee, plus a surging British pound, does make acquisitions, even for "reasonably" hammer price coins, more expensive.

For me at least, Roma seems to be an outlier. For example, let's say there's a coin that has a market value of 300. At auctions like Leu and CNG, if I put in a bid of 400 I'll have a strong chance of winning the coin. It's not guaranteed, because someone may want it more, but the large majority of the time I'll either win or be the underbidder. Further, if I bid 800 because I really want the coin, at these auctions I'll win.

That's not the case at Roma. There are definitely some bidders there who don't care.

Interestingly, and this is just perception, the bidding started getting more out of hand when the legal troubles were announced. I thought this may dampen their bidding, but my experience has been the opposite. However, it's not shill bidding since I'm losing most of the coins. I really don't know. I've thought they may be advertising more in China and Russia, but I could also just be unfortunate that there's a handful of deep-pocketed collectors who only want to buy from UK sellers and happen to collect the same obscure coins as I.

[Rand]

Today I felt the bidding was reasonable. A few nice/rare lots expected heavy bidding, but there were a few unsolds as well. I wanted one coin, and I got it for only slightly above the expected average. Not a terribly exciting lot, but it is still a single-die variety, a die-match of the Bibliothèque nationale piece and the better one of the three known from trade. So, I do not complain.

During their recent big auction, the location of the remote bidders could be seen by the flags of their countries. The bidding was heavy at the session I was interested in, driven by American bidder(s).

[ewomack]

I think that I'm very glad that I didn't even know it was going on. There were some nice things on there that I may have grossly overbid for. 😁

Edited July 19, 2023 by ewomack

[robinjojo]

One relatively new program instituted by Roma, the rewards program, has me a bit confused, but then it doesn't take much to put me into this more or less permanent state.  I know that there are three levels, and I am currently at bronze (I would have been happy with lead).  I really don't understand the value of the points or how they are accrued. 

I guess this program was created to attract business, and this is the first instance that I am in such a program auction-wise.  My credit card also has a rewards program, pretty inscrutable from my perspective.  I'm always wary of these schemes, but I'll take what I can get, assuming I can get it.

Getting back to the coins, yes, there are some remainder coins, and rarities did fetched generally very healthy hammer prices.  This could be a chance to pick up a Byzantine coin from one of the rarer mints, such as Ravenna.  I noticed a few from the mint that didn't attract bids.  Of course the after sale prices for these coins have not been posted yet, and there is also that surging exchange rate favoring the British pound now to contend with.

[Ancient Coin Hunter]

I have never bid in as Roma auction. With the recent news I thought it wise to stay away. 

[Nerosmyfavorite68]

Some were relative bargains, like the grotty Maurice Ravenna follis for 60 pounds. A thousand pounds for an Anastasius I follis though? I didn't look to see if it's a rare type.  It's certainly nice, but I'm fairly sure (double sure since I was looking recently) that one can find a comparably nice vcoins one for 1/2 to 1/3 of that price.

It's a moot point.  I've been out of the auction game since the Clinton administration.  It's just not worth the trouble and hassle to try to bid live, only to have the lots flung into a mailer.  I've heard that Roma is pretty good about mailing, so that comment is a general one.