Benefactor robinjojo Posted April 4, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted April 4, 2023 I'm not sure if a thread was created yet for the milled pillar and portrait coinage of the Spanish colonies and mainland (no pillars there, shield and portrait types only). These beautiful and historically important coins had a run from the late 1720s through 1825. Famed as trade coins, coveted especially in Asia, particularly China, where silver was valued at a premium to gold, the pillar and portrait 8 reales and related divisions are available to collectors in a wide range of condition, including coins with interesting "chopmarks" merchant applied validating countermarks. Many have been salvaged from the numerous wrecks of Spanish and other ships that were carrying these coins in their holds for trade in distant lands. Like cobs, their hammer struck predecessors, a milled coin in the hand conveys a legacy of history and commerce during the 18th and 19th centuries. Here are a few from my collection. I will post more as they are photographed. Mexico was the first colonial mint to produce milled coinage, starting in 1732, with assayer F. Milled coinage appeared in Spain the decade before, but not with the pillars and waves design, but instead the traditionally shield (obverse) and cross (reverse) design. Spain, 8 reales, Philip V, Madrid (crowned M), 1728 JJ. KM 336.2 27.07 grams Mexico, Philip V, 8 reales, 1733 F. A Marathon, Florida Keys find. KM 103 25.6 grams This is my earliest example, from the 1733 Fleet. Unlike subsequent issues, this 8 reales has a single assayer, F. There's an even rare variety of this date with the mint mark as "M (dot) X", instead of the traditional o over M. Mexico, 4 reales, Philip V, 1735 MF. KM 94 Gilboy M-4-7-a 13.23 grams This coin is a rare variant for the 4 reales of 1735, with a rosette above the MF on the reverse, instead of the normal dot. Mexico, 8 reales, Philip V, 1744 MF. Heavy chopmarks and test cuts. KM 103 26.4 grams Mexico, 8 reales, Charles III, 1761 MM. KM 105; Gilboy M8-39 26.94 grams Lima, 8 reales, Ferdinand VI, 1753 J. KM 55.1; Gilboy L-8-3 26.90 grams Guatemala, 8 reales, Charles III, 1770 P. KM 27.2 26.93 grams 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanxi Posted April 5, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted April 5, 2023 (edited) I hope this fits in this thread: Mexico/China Ruler: Carolus III., 1759-1788 Obv: Bust, CAROLUS•III•DEI•GRATIA•1787• Rev: Coat of Arms, Pilars, •HISPAN•ET IND•REX•Mo•8R•F•M• Value: 8 Reales Year: 1787 Material: AR, 26.7g,39mm Ref.: Calicó/Calicó/Trigo 856 and this: Mexico, Ferdinand VI., 1746-1759 Obv: bust Rev: coat of arms? Value: 8 Reales Year: 1748 Material: AR, 40mm Edited April 5, 2023 by shanxi 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kali Posted April 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted April 5, 2023 Ferdinand VI (1747 - 1759) Mexico AR 8 Reales O: FERDND·VI·D·G·HISPAN·ET IND·REX M F 8, Crowned arms shield flanked by value and initials. R: VTRAQUE VNUM; Mo 1756 MoCrowned hemispheres flanked by crowned pillars. 27g 39mm KM#104.2 Ex. Harlan J Berk Buy or Bid Sale #212, July 2020 Charles III (1716 -1788 A.D.) Spain 8 Reales Mexico Mint 5 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Kowsky Posted April 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted April 5, 2023 14 hours ago, robinjojo said: I'm not sure if a thread was created yet for the milled pillar and portrait coinage of the Spanish colonies and mainland (no pillars there, shield and portrait types only). These beautiful and historically important coins had a run from the late 1720s through 1825. Famed as trade coins, coveted especially in Asia, particularly China, where silver was valued at a premium to gold, the pillar and portrait 8 reales and related divisions are available to collectors in a wide range of condition, including coins with interesting "chopmarks" merchant applied validating countermarks. Many have been salvaged from the numerous wrecks of Spanish and other ships that were carrying these coins in their holds for trade in distant lands. Like cobs, their hammer struck predecessors, a milled coin in the hand conveys a legacy of history and commerce during the 18th and 19th centuries. Here are a few from my collection. I will post more as they are photographed. Mexico was the first colonial mint to produce milled coinage, starting in 1732, with assayer F. Milled coinage appeared in Spain the decade before, but not with the pillars and waves design, but instead the traditionally shield (obverse) and cross (reverse) design. Spain, 8 reales, Philip V, Madrid (crowned M), 1728 JJ. KM 336.2 27.07 grams Mexico, Philip V, 8 reales, 1733 F. A Marathon, Florida Keys find. KM 103 25.6 grams This is my earliest example, from the 1733 Fleet. Unlike subsequent issues, this 8 reales has a single assayer, F. There's an even rare variety of this date with the mint mark as "M (dot) X", instead of the traditional o over M. Mexico, 4 reales, Philip V, 1735 MF. KM 94 Gilboy M-4-7-a 13.23 grams This coin is a rare variant for the 4 reales of 1735, with a rosette above the MF on the reverse, instead of the normal dot. Mexico, 8 reales, Philip V, 1744 MF. Heavy chopmarks and test cuts. KM 103 26.4 grams Mexico, 8 reales, Charles III, 1761 MM. KM 105; Gilboy M8-39 26.94 grams Lima, 8 reales, Ferdinand VI, 1753 J. KM 55.1; Gilboy L-8-3 26.90 grams Guatemala, 8 reales, Charles III, 1770 P. KM 27.2 26.93 grams Impressive group ☺️! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Kowsky Posted April 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted April 5, 2023 2 hours ago, shanxi said: I hope this fits in this thread: Mexico/China Ruler: Carolus III., 1759-1788 Obv: Bust, CAROLUS•III•DEI•GRATIA•1787• Rev: Coat of Arms, Pilars, •HISPAN•ET IND•REX•Mo•8R•F•M• Value: 8 Reales Year: 1787 Material: AR, 26.7g,39mm Ref.: Calicó/Calicó/Trigo 856 and this: Mexico, Ferdinand VI., 1746-1759 Obv: bust Rev: coat of arms? Value: 8 Reales Year: 1748 Material: AR, 40mm The second coin got chopped into oblivion 😮! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Kowsky Posted April 5, 2023 · Member Share Posted April 5, 2023 I sold the 3 chop marked coins pictured below at CNG E-Sale 483 for $826, including the buyer's premium ☺️. The Hong Kong trade dollar is a rare coin & rarely seen chopped. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted April 5, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted April 5, 2023 (edited) Thanks for the posts and keep them coming! Here's a portrait 8 reales of Charles IV, Potosi. Potosi 8 reales Charles IV ,1791 PR . Possibly from the Cuzco hoard. KM 73 And another pillar 8 reales from Guatemala, 1771, the last year of pillars from this mint. For the period of 1769-1771 this mint struck 8 reales on narrower and thicker flans, resulting in parts of the legend being off the flan. There is a very scarce variety for 1769 with the typical wider flan. Guatemala, 8 reales, Charles III, 1771 P KM 27.2 26.8 grams I forgot to include a representative from Fotosi! Potosi, 8 reales, Charles III, 1770 JR. KM 50; Gilboy P-8-4 27.3 grams Edited April 5, 2023 by robinjojo 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted April 5, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted April 5, 2023 Santiago, Charles IV, 8 reales, 1793 DA. KM 51, C 61, E 44 26.94 grams 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted April 5, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted April 5, 2023 (edited) Here's a pillar of Ferdinand VI, Mexico, 1754. There are several varieties of this date listed in Gilboy and KM, with various crown, assayer combinations and other features, some quite rare. This is one of the more common varieties. Mexico, 8 reales, Ferdinand VI, 1754 MF. KM 104.1 Gilboy M 8-27 26.94 grams Portrait coinage continued through the wars of independence in Mexico and South America. During these times of upheaval communications and deliveries of silver were frequently interrupted between Mexico City and outlying silver producing provinces, such as Zacatecas. Because of this situation, the royalists set up branch mints, as did the insurgents, with their makeshift, often mobile mints. When independence was finally achieved in Mexico, in 1821, the royalist coins with the portrait of Ferdinand VII continued to be minted notably in Zacatecas, Guadalajara, with 1821 as a "frozen" date. This following the brief Iturbide "empire" of 1822-1823, republican coinage was introduced in 1823, in Mexico City. The royalist mints of Zacatecas, Guadalajara, Durango and Chihuahua continued through the Republic, with others added over the years, until 1905. Mexico, Zacatecas, 8 reales, Ferdinand VII, 1818 AG. Royalist issue. KM 111.5 25.76 grams The dies of this crude coin are clearly of local manufacture. Edited April 6, 2023 by robinjojo 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor robinjojo Posted April 12, 2023 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted April 12, 2023 Sometimes coins are found with letters in the legend or elsewhere transposed, switched in position to the next letter. This coin however is a deluxe job of transposition. The normal Latin spelling on pillar and portrait coins for Spain is "HISPAN" for "Hispaniarum". The individual responsible for punching the shield die side legend for this coin must have a bad night, creating "HIAPSN" instead, resulting in a very rare variety of what is normally a somewhat scarce date. I was lucky to be able to acquire this coin, even in its salvaged state. It must have been a virtually uncirculated coin when in ended up in the drink, as all of the details are quite bold. Gilboy notes a variety with the "M" of the right mint mark missing the lateral bar. That bar is present on this example. Lima, 8 reales, Philip V, 1771 JM, HIAPSN error. KM 64.2; Gilboy L-24-Aa (R5) 25.77 grams 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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