Tejas Posted January 13, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 13, 2023 (edited) I was after the coin below for a long time and bought it right away when it came up on Vcoins. The price of EUR 180 was very reasonable in my view. It is a Pecunia Maiorina of Theodosius I Obv.: DN THEODOSIVS P F AVG Rev.: VIRTUS EXERCITI Mint: Alexandria (ALEA) Date: 383 - 388 Weight: 5.13 gr. I really like these large bronze coins of the late Roman period. I think they are difficult to find in good condition and I was really happy when this one came up. The dating is from the seller and I would really like to know how these coins are dated to certain periods during the reign of Theodosius. Edited January 13, 2023 by Tejas 22 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prieure de Sion Posted January 13, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 13, 2023 Ah i see that coin last days at VCoins - and remember about - because I like it. How much is the diameter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dafydd Posted January 13, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2023 Here is my Theodesius Follis These are the sellers details. Theodosius I AD 379-395. Antioch Follis Æ 19 mm, 2,12 g SAVOCA BLUE AUCTION NO 134 LOT 1217 15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Maximus Posted January 13, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 13, 2023 58 minutes ago, Tejas said: Pecunia Maiorina I believe the denomination is called a decargyrus. Here are some of mine from Theodosius I: 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Conduitt Posted January 13, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tejas said: Date: 383 - 388 The dating is from the seller and I would really like to know how these coins are dated to certain periods during the reign of Theodosius. Those dates correspond with Magnus Maximus's reign. So perhaps it has something to do with the VIRTVS EXERCITI coins of Magnus Maximus being issued at Constantinople, which was under Theodosius’s control, not Magnus Maximus’s. The fact that Arcadius and not Gratian has this reverse gives 383 for the same reason. Edited January 14, 2023 by John Conduitt 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Julius Posted January 13, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 13, 2023 13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seth77 Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Tejas said: The dating is from the seller and I would really like to know how these coins are dated to certain periods during the reign of Theodosius. That's the dating from RIC, DOC has them in the 386-393 period. But these periods are not related to types individually but to groups of types that correspond to a certain historical period. For RIC the period begins with the elevation of Arcadius and the clear direction of Theodosius towards his own dynastic claim in the East. The period also corresponds largely with the reign of Maximus. DOC is more advanced and puts this common type after the first round of dynastic Theodosian types: the very early Arcadius coinage and the coinage for Aelia Flaccila (who dies in 386, hence the beginning of the period for DOC). But the issue for Maximus dates the beginning of this type to at least late autumn-winter of 384, when some sort of understanding was reached between Maximus and Theodosius, and Theodosius even briefly recognized Maximus as a colleague (minting the extremely rare maiorina of this type for him also at Constantinople). My suspicion is that like in the case of the REPARATIO REIPVB maiorina, which ends in the East before January 383 but is continued in the West until likely 388, this type also has different dating corresponding to particular mints, probably with a beginning in Constantinople around very late 384 or early 385, from where it spread throughout the East but not at the same time. Probably 386 is the safe bet for when the type remains the only maiorina type in the East, after the discontinuation of the coinage for Flacilla. And it remains the only maiorina in the East until around late 392 or early 393, when the GLORIA ROMANORVM emperor standing is introduced, possibly to mark the elevation of Honorius. The chronology is not very exact and there are many plot holes in it -- for instance the pre-383 emperor standing on galley type could have survived in the East until the death of Gratian in the summer of 383 or perhaps even later at some mints, in the name of Theodosius only. If I'm not mistaken, DOC mentions an extremely rare issue for Arcadius. The type is so plentiful that it is possible that it continued for a while. It's the same with your type, which at Alexandria is very closely related style-wise to the next maiorina type arriving in 393, just check out the typically large lettering and smallish Imperial effigies present on both types. So probably here the type extends from around 386 to 393, when the same mint masters and die cutters start working on the GLORIA ROMANORVM type. Edited January 14, 2023 by seth77 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLTcoins Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) The name of the Theodosian AE2 denomination ("decargyrus") and a terminus ante quem for its official circulation (April 12, 395) can be found in the Codex Theodosianus (9.23.2): Translation: Emperors Arcadius and Honorius Augusti to Dexter, Praetorian Prefect. We command that only the centenionalis shall be handled in public use and that the coining of larger money shall be abolished. No person, therefore, shall dare to exchange the decargyrus for another coin, and he shall know that the aforesaid money, which can be seized if found in public use, will be vindicated to the fisc. Given on the day before the ides of April at Milan in the year of the consulship of Olybrius and Probinus (April 12, 395). Latin original: Impp. Arcadius et Honorius aa. Dextro praefecto praetorio. Centenionalem tantum nummum in conversatione publica tractari praecipimus maioris pecuniae figuratione submota. Nullus igitur decargyrum nummum alio audeat commutare, sciens fisco eandem pecuniam vindicandam, quae in publica potuerit conversatione deprehendi. Dat. prid. id. april. Mediolano Olybrio et Probino conss. Edited January 14, 2023 by DLTcoins 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severus Alexander Posted January 14, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 14, 2023 That's a fabulous example, @Tejas, the Alexandrian ones are not easy to come by! Here's my Arcadius version: 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ominus1 Posted January 14, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 14, 2023 that one is in dang near 'mint' state....very low if any circulation ....i have not one, not two, but 3 coins of ole Therodosius .. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) Thanks all for the great information, especially on the dating and on the name of the denomination. I didn't know that before. Now I remember why I was so keen to buy the coin, when I saw it on MA Münzen (not Vcoins) for EUR 180,-: Leu sold a very similar coin for CHF 1800,- in May last year. I remember that the coin was high on by wishlist, but I was totally and completely outbid. I think my highest offer was under CHF 500,-. https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=9492953 So I am super happy that I didn't win the Leu coin, but got this one for a 10th of the price. However, I realize of course that the Leu price is the outlier here. Somebody completely overpaid for the piece. Edited January 14, 2023 by Tejas 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 14, 2023 17 hours ago, Prieure de Sion said: Ah i see that coin last days at VCoins - and remember about - because I like it. How much is the diameter? It was actually on MA Münzen. It had been newly listed and I bought it right away. The diameter is 23 mm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prieure de Sion Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 14, 2023 1 minute ago, Tejas said: It was actually on MA Münzen. It had been newly listed and I bought it right away. The diameter is 23 mm. Ah... Milan or Madrid, the main thing is Italy! (a German football player) VCoins, MA-Shop... same for me. But - I remember this coin exactly - because I like it. Gratulation for this buy. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qcumbor Posted January 14, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 14, 2023 Excellent addition @Tejas, it would fit nicely with my own Arcadius example from the same alexandrian mint !! Q 13 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 14, 2023 2 minutes ago, Qcumbor said: Excellent addition @Tejas, it would fit nicely with my own Arcadius example from the same alexandrian mint !! Yes it would. Let me know if you are planning to sell yours 🙂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) I have a maiorina of Arcadius of the Alexandria mint. This is one of my favorite coins of my entire collection. I always come back to this one. It ticks all the right boxes: interesting bust, interesting reverse, perfect condition, great eye appeal, etc ... Edited January 14, 2023 by Tejas 14 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 14, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 14, 2023 19 minutes ago, Prieure de Sion said: Ah... Milan or Madrid, the main thing is Italy! (a German football player) VCoins, MA-Shop... same for me. But - I remember this coin exactly - because I like it. Gratulation for this buy. Thanks a lot ... there is a lot of overlap between Vcoins and MA-Shop anyway. I can never remember where I saw something (and Vcoins seems to have this habit of clearing the shopping basket from time to time) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPK Posted January 14, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 14, 2023 Nice coin! I remember seeing that one come up for sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor DonnaML Posted January 14, 2023 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) Wonderful coins, @Tejas. The appearance of your coins, and @Qcumbor's maiorina of Arcadius, very much remind me of my own maiorina of Aelia Flaccilla, also from Alexandria: Aelia Flaccilla (first wife of Theodosius I and mother of Arcadius & Honorius), AE maiorina, AD 383-386, Alexandria mint, 2nd Officina. Obv. Draped bust of Aelia Flaccilla right, wearing necklace, earrings, and elaborate headdress with diadem, AEL FLAC-CILLA AVG / Rev. Empress standing facing, head right, her arms crossed on her breast, SALVS REI-PVBLICAE; in exergue, ALEB [mint mark ALE = Alexandria; B = 2nd Officina]. 24 mm., 6.62 g. RIC IX 17 (p. 302); Sear RCV V 20622; Cohen 6; LRBC II 2897 [R.A.G. Carson, P.V. Hill, & J.P.C. Kent, Late Roman Bronze Coinage, A.D. 324-498 (London 1972)]. Purchased Nov. 2022 from Kirk Davis, Claremont, CA, Cat. No. 80, Fall 2022, Lot 79; ex. Ira & Larry Goldberg Coins & Collectibles, Inc., Los Angeles, CA, Auction 75, 09.24.2013, Lot 2652. My only coin of Theodosius I himself is an AE3, from Alexandria as well: Theodosius I, AE3 (Sear: Centenionalis), AD 379-383 [Emperor AD 379-395], Alexandria mint, 3rd Officina. Obv. D N THEODOSIVS P F AVG - Diademed (Pearls), draped and cuirassed bust right / Rev. CONCORDIA AVGGG - Constantinopolis, helmeted, seated facing on throne, head right, holding spear and globe, right foot on prow. ALE(Γ) [gamma] in exergue. RIC IX 11 (p. 300), Sear RCV V 20535. 17.72 mm, 1.9 g. Edited January 14, 2023 by DonnaML 16 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qcumbor Posted January 14, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 14, 2023 I knew you would post your Aelia Flacilla @DonnaML, and I'm never tired of seeing it. Q 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orange Julius Posted January 15, 2023 · Member Share Posted January 15, 2023 These later empire coins from Alexandria are great! Alexandria just seemed to produce higher quality coins than all other mints of the time. I have a Valentinian from A bit earlier that I really like too. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 20, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 20, 2023 (edited) On 1/15/2023 at 12:49 AM, Qcumbor said: I knew you would post your Aelia Flacilla @DonnaML, and I'm never tired of seeing it. Q Exactly what I thought 🙂 Here is my Aelia Flaccilla from Alexandria. Obv.: AEL FLAC CILLA Rev.: SALVS REI PVBLICAE Edited January 20, 2023 by Tejas 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tejas Posted January 20, 2023 · Member Author Share Posted January 20, 2023 This is perhaps my nicest Aelia Flacilla: Aelia Flacilla AE-22 AEL FLACCILLA AVG // SALVS REI PVBLICAE -- CON E Mint: Constantinople, officina 5 Date: AD 383 Weight: 5.21 g Diameter: 22mm 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qcumbor Posted January 20, 2023 · Supporter Share Posted January 20, 2023 Both are exceptional Q 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.