Anonymous Follis

[Simon]

Most Eastern Roman Collections contain at least one of these large coppers from the 10th and 11th centuries. Why? The are impressive, easy to find and excellent coins to represent the empire. 

Class A, Impressive large copper near the beginning of the series.This one could use some cleaning, but the detail is excellent. 

Class B Sharp strike but double struck on the reverse, the dies were sharp. 

Class C, I have had this one a long time filled with its charms. 

 

Feel free to share your anonymous follis. The more the better. 

[JeandAcre]

Three magnificent examples, @Simon.  The obverse border legend (right, '+EMMA NOVHL') always carries a pronounced premium.

Here are my two from the earlier classes, for which pictures are easy to find.  From here, the second one (Class A, shown first) was a real coup; best example I've ever had.  But I like the overstriking on the obverse of the first one (Class B, temp. Romanus III.)

 

Edited December 5, 2022 by JeandAcre

[Severus Alexander]

I especially like your Class C!  Are there two varieties of this, one with a 1/2 length and the other a 3/4 length figure of Christ?

I sort of accidentally ended up with quite a few of these, but only recently decided to aim for the set.  My rarest is the Amorium type... a few of these have shown up on the market lately although they're still extremely rare.

Emperor attributions below follow Sear; they're controversial.

[Simon]

I have never seen the Amorium type before.  Very interesting creation. I would love to know more about that type. 

 

I have most of the others but I am missing SBCV-1888 but I have some really nice examples of some of the more common ones. 

This class D is very nice. 

This Class G is one of my favorites. 

This class F was a bit difficult to find in this condition. I would love to get one with a face. 

These two I found in group lots, not as nice but harder to come by. 

 

I found the article on the type.

(99+) “A New Anonymous Follis from Amorium.” The Numismatic Circular 103/10 (December 1995), p. 376. | Chris S Lightfoot - Academia.edu

Edited December 5, 2022 by Simon

[Celator]

[sand]

There are some nice looking and interesting coins, in this thread.

6 hours ago, Simon said:

Most Eastern Roman Collections contain at least one of these large coppers from the 10th and 11th centuries.

I have an Eastern Roman collection, and yes, I have 1 of these coins. It's one of my favorite coins, in my collection.

Basil II or Constantine VIII AE 40 Nummi Follis. 1023 AD to 1028 AD. Constantinople Mint. Class A3. Sear 1818. 28 mm. 9.27 grams. Obverse Jesus Christ With "EMMANOVHL" On Left Edge Greek For "Emmanuel" Meaning "God With Us" And "IC XC" On Left And Right Abbreviation For "IHSUS XRISTUS" Greek For "Jesus Christ". Reverse "IHSUS XRISTUS BASILEU BASILE" Greek For "Jesus Christ King Of Kings". 

Edited December 5, 2022 by sand

[ambr0zie]

I do not collect Byzantine coins but I wanted 2 examples of these. They are not high quality coins but I still like them.

Attributed to John I (11 December 969 - 10 January 976 A.D.) Constantinople
Anonymous Follis Æ Class A1
23 mm, 6,54 g
Obverse: +ЄMMA-NOVHL. facing bust of Christ, wearing nimbus cruciger, two pellets in each cross limb, pallium and colobium, holding ornamented Gospels with both hands, to left IC, to right XC; reverse + IhSuS / XRISTuS / bASILEu / bASILE (Jesus Christ King of Kings).Reverse: +IҺSЧS XRISTЧS ЬASILЄЧ ЬASILЄ, legend in four lines across field, circle below.
Sear 1793

 

Anonymous follis. AE 10.35gr
Romanus III or Michael IV, 12 November 1028 - 10 December 1041 A.D.
Bronze anonymous follis, class B; SBCV 1823, Constantinople mint, obverse EMMANOVHL, facing bust of Christ, wearing nimbus cruciger, pallium and colobium, holding gospels with both hands, to left IC, to right XC; reverse cross on three steps with pellet at each extremity, in fields IS - XS / BAS-ILE / BAS-ILE (Jesus Christ, King of Kings)

 

[quant.geek]

21 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

I especially like your Class C!  Are there two varieties of this, one with a 1/2 length and the other a 3/4 length figure of Christ?

I sort of accidentally ended up with quite a few of these, but only recently decided to aim for the set.  My rarest is the Amorium type... a few of these have shown up on the market lately although they're still extremely rare.

Emperor attributions below follow Sear; they're controversial.

I was the underbidder on that Amorium and I lost both of them in that auction, at least it went to you @Severus Alexander.

[Severus Alexander]

1 hour ago, quant.geek said:

I was the underbidder on that Amorium and I lost both of them in that auction, at least it went to you @Severus Alexander.

Thanks, I'm sorry I edged you out! As it happens you, in turn, edged @Valentinian out. We Byzantine fans make a small world! 😆 I'm sure you'll both snag one eventually, and @Simon too!  I hope you all get a bargain!

@Simon, thanks for that link. At the bottom of p.4 there's an old one from 1992 which, at that time, they attributed to the Crusaders at Edessa, as some kind of mule. It's noted as being overstruck on a Baldwin I follis. Mine is also overstruck. I discussed this with @Valentinian, and we decided the overstrike was on a Class I.  Here's the full-size photo from the auction (the coin is a lot darker in hand):

The overstrike does fit somewhat with a Class I, but as I noted to Valentinian, it's not a perfect fit for these three dots:

The Chris Lightfoot link made me wonder about this again.  Might my coin be an overstrike on an Edessa follis, something like these from the very beginning of the 12th century (Baldwin II)?

There's even a bit of curlicue there perhaps corresponding to the RHS of the photo above. And is that the bottom of his chain mail you can see at the left edge of my coin's reverse?

My coin's weight is 5.7g, more typical for a Class I but still compatible with an Edessa follis. (The particular one above is usually in the 3-5g range though.)

What do you guys think? Class I undertype, Edessa, or something else?

[Simon]

Well from the hoard find we know it was from the time of class G or latter so Class I is not that far off. I do not see an exact match but a class H is possible as well. 

My choice would be Edessa Follis, it would make sense to restrike a coin during that time period that did not fit in Eastern Roman coinage. 

[Celator]

1 hour ago, Severus Alexander said:

Thanks, I'm sorry I edged you out! As it happens you, in turn, edged @Valentinian out. We Byzantine fans make a small world! 😆 I'm sure you'll both snag one eventually, and @Simon too!  I hope you all get a bargain!

@Simon, thanks for that link. At the bottom of p.4 there's an old one from 1992 which, at that time, they attributed to the Crusaders at Edessa, as some kind of mule. It's noted as being overstruck on a Baldwin I follis. Mine is also overstruck. I discussed this with @Valentinian, and we decided the overstrike was on a Class I.  Here's the full-size photo from the auction (the coin is a lot darker in hand):

The overstrike does fit somewhat with a Class I, but as I noted to Valentinian, it's not a perfect fit for these three dots:

The Chris Lightfoot link made me wonder about this again.  Might my coin be an overstrike on an Edessa follis, something like these from the very beginning of the 12th century (Baldwin II)?

There's even a bit of curlicue there perhaps corresponding to the RHS of the photo above. And is that the bottom of his chain mail you can see at the left edge of my coin's reverse?

My coin's weight is 5.7g, more typical for a Class I but still compatible with an Edessa follis. (The particular one above is usually in the 3-5g range though.)

What do you guys think? Class I undertype, Edessa, or something else?

I would say class I as well and gospels visible at 9 o'clock on the reverse making it a flip over os.

Edited December 6, 2022 by Celator

[VD76]

On 12/5/2022 at 8:21 PM, Severus Alexander said:

What do you guys think? Class I undertype, Edessa, or something else?

 I think that the  style of "amorium" follis looks more Byzantine than crusader Edessa. The  pictures of coin in  the article that  overstruck on Baldwin's follis is too blurry  , so is impossible to confirm that  . I think that your coin is overstruck on SBCV 1889 . As mentioned by Celator , you can see part of gospel on the reverse. 

Edited December 7, 2022 by VD76
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[Severus Alexander]

Thanks for the feedback, @Simon, @Celator, and @VD76!  I guess the jury is still out about the undertype, although the preponderance of opinion seems to lean towards class I still. That's my leaning as well... maybe if I clean it a bit more all will become clear! I agree with VD76 that the Amorium type's style fits better with its being part of the Byzantine series rather than Edessan, and its fabric too I might add.

[Al Kowsky]

Many great examples are posted on this thread 🤨! My favorite is posted below.

Edited December 15, 2022 by Al Kowsky
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