zumbly

40 minutes ago, Severus Alexander said:

Doug was just asking about these in the Magna Graecia thread, @zumbly… I took an amateurish stab at answering his historical context question, but maybe you actually know something!  Here’s his comment:

 

The 525-425 BC date I have for it is what's in HGC.  In the brief discussion there about Kroton's coinage of the period, there's no mention of it being one of Kroton's alliance issues.  I think Kraay answers it : 

17 minutes ago, Severus Alexander said:

Green malachite can be stubborn, but still, the cleaning must not have been very aggressive. If the container was sealed air tight, is it possible the coins are as found, do you think?

I'd be out of my depth there, but it'd be interesting if they came out of the ground that way.  Maybe someone who's done some research on 4th century hoards may know.

8 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

Well that is a @Curtisimo coin if I ever saw one!

Hah, that's almost exactly what I said to Curtis when he showed it to me!  And now we have a classic Curtis post to accompany it.

Your photos are much better than the auction pics, Curtis.  Great coin, and beautifully toned!  I definitely want one of these some day.  For now, there's my little triobol...

BRUTTIUM, Kroton
AR Triobol. 1.21g, 11.4mm.
BRUTTIUM, Kroton, circa 525-425 BC. SNG ANS 327; HN Italy 2127.
O: KPO (retrograde), tripod terminating in lion's feet.
R: Pegasos flying left; koppa below.

6 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

Looks very bronze rather than pure copper.  By contrast, here's a lightly patinated brown, more coppery looking coin from Siscia (Valentinian):... and then here is a largely unpatinated Valens I got from @zumbly.  I don't know if it has been cleaned or if it came out of a hoard this way.  (Any idea, Z?)  Very coppery, like a penny, although it does have a bit of a yellowish tinge on the face.  This is the example I have that comes closest to what it would have looked like coming out of the mint.

That came from a group of Valens and Valentinian coins I bought that were all lacking patina.  I don't know for sure if they all came from a hoard, but I think the likelihood's high (all from Siscia, all the same look, quite a number still with those green malachite hoard deposits).  I think they had been cleaned and showed varying degrees of retoning... some had that slightly yellowish hue, others had become darker, but others were still fresh and copper penny-like, such as the one below:

1 hour ago, Qcumbor said:

You probably owe that to Sev's honesty 😇

Q

Heh!  As far as I know, my coin didn't make a pit stop in Canada on its double round trip from the UK to Singapore, back to the UK and then finally again to Singapore.  😁 One thing's for sure, though, it does seem like ancient collectors are an honest bunch!

I've always liked this provincial struck under Rhoemetalces I which has a little capricorn playing with its globe before the busts of Augustus and Livia..

KINGS OF THRACE. Rhoemetalces I
AE28. 13.51g, 28mm.
THRACE, uncertain mint, late 1st century BC - AD 12. RPC I 1708; Youroukova 182-4.
O: BAΣIΛEΩΣ POIMHTAΛKOY, Jugate busts of Rhoemetalces, diademed, and Pythadoris, right.
R: KAIΣAPOΣ ΣEBAΣTOY, Jugate busts of Augustus, laureate, and Livia, right; to right, capricorn right, holding globe.

And another Zodiac series drachm.... this one depicting Mars in Aries.

ANTONINUS PIUS
AE Drachm. 25.25g, 35.7mm.
EGYPT, Alexandria, RY 8 (144/5). Dattari (Savio) 2958; Emmett 1461.8; K&G 35.267; RPC IV.4 online temp 13540.
O: Laureate head right.
R: Zodiac Series, Mars in Aries: Ram (Aries) leaping right, head to left; to upper left, helmeted and cuirassed bust of Ares (Mars) to right; above, star; L H (date) below.

What a prolonged and harrowing misadventure for those poor coins and you!  So glad they finally turned up... and what a Nero!  I'd love to get that reverse type some day. 

14 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

(An aside: I once received a Julius Caesar portrait denarius instead of a cheap Republican As! 🤯 And returned it to the dealer, of course, so they could get it to its rightful owner.

Coincidentally, the only time I had something similar happen to me was with my JC portrait denarius!  The auction house had sent it to the wrong customer, and after over a month of frustrating back-and-forths with their office manager, they found the package returned  to their office.  The honest collector had sent it back to them... phew!

14 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

Also: please share one of your 2021 top ten coins, lost-and-founds, favourite Neros, or anything else relevant!

One of my favorites from my 2021 top ten list is also a "Nero." (sorry you missed out on the InAsta example, I'm optimistic we'll find you a better one yet!) 😊

NERO
AE Contorniate. 18.18g, 36mm.
Rome, circa late 4th century AD. Alföldi, Kontorniat 200; Cohen VIII pg. 290, 129.
O: IMP NERO CAESAR AVG P MAX, laureate head to right; engraved palm leaf before.
R: Olympias, mother of Alexander the Great, reclining left on couch, extending hand to serpent coiled at her knee.

12 hours ago, Curtisimo said:

If you don’t post a top list now I shall be very very disappointed!

Lets see that list!!!!!!!!  

What he said! 

Wow, great coin... congratulations!  Here's mine, with yet more wreath flatness.  😁

JULIUS CAESAR
AR Denarius. 3.77g, 19mm.
Rome mint, struck by L. Aemilius Buca, February - March 44 BC.
Crawford 480/8; Sydenham 1061; RCV 1411.  
O: CAESAR DICT PERPETVO, wreathed head of Caesar facing right.  
R: L BVCA , Venus standing left, holding Victory and a sceptre.
Ex David Sellwood Collection; ex Seaby Coin & Medal Bulletin (1 Oct 1977), lot 793

Welcome!  Excellent info and coin.

I was happy to have won the two coins below in Leu's sale of the Gollnow Collection of Civil War coinage last year.  The first one was struck by the Rhine legions.

CIVIL WAR. Rhine Legions
AR Denarius. 2.78g, 16.8mm.
Uncertain mint in Gaul or Rhine Valley, circa May/June-December AD 68.
'S P Q R GRoup'. BMC p. 298, * note var. (GENER); CG 113.1 (this coin); Cohen 428 var. (GENER); Martin 87 var. (GENER); Nicolas 80 corr. and var. (GENER, but misdescribed as GENERIS); RIC 69 var. (GENER).
O: SALVS GENERIS [HVMANI], Victory standing left on globe, holding wreath in her right hand and palm frond in her left.
R: S•P•/Q•R• within oak wreath.
Ex Dipl.-Ing. Christian Gollnow; ex Classical Numismatic Group 109, 12 September 2018, 643

CIVIL WAR. Forces of Galba in Spain
AR Denarius. 3.21g, 17.9mm.
Uncertain mint in Spain, Group A.II, 3 April - 2nd half of June AD 68. In the name of Augustus.
BMC 49; CG 146.4 (this coin); Cohen 98 (Augustan prototype); Martin A 10;  Nicolas A8; RIC 92.
O: CAESAR AVGVSTVS, laureate head of Augustus to right.
R: DIVVS - IVLIVS, Sidus Iulium: eight-rayed comet with tail upwards.
Ex Dipl.-Ing. Christian Gollnow Collection, ex Classical Numismatic Group 47, 16 September 1998, 1499

Wow, that's a very interesting piece, @Hesiod! 

Here's a Roman provincial of Corinth showing Bellerophon not actually astride Pegasus, possibly in the act of taming it?

NERO
AE20. 6.96g, 20.1mm.
CORINTHIA, Corinth, circa AD 57-58 or AD 58-59. Ti. Claudius Optatus and C. Julius Polyaenus, duoviri. BCD Corinth 454; RPC 1201.
O: NERO CLAV CAES AVG, bare head right.
R: TI CLAVDIO OPTATO / COR, Bellerophon advancing left, holding shield and seizing by bridle Pegasos standing left.

And the RR denarius with Bellerophon riding Pegasus on one side and Pegasus's mama Medusa on the other.

ROMAN REPUBLIC.
L Cossutius Sabula
AR Denarius. 3.95g, 18mm.
Rome mint, 72 BC. Crawford 395/1; Sydenham 790; Cossutia 1.
O: Head of Medusa left, winged and entwined with serpents; SABVLA upwards behind.
R: Bellerophon riding Pegasus right, hurling spear; control mark X behind, L COSSVTI C F below.

Here's a SOLI INVICTO to celebrate the Sun (though the pic below was taken by the light of an annular solar eclipse in 2019 😊).

PROBUS
AE Antoninianus. 3.31g, 22mm.
Rome mint, circa AD 276-282. RIC 202; Cohen 644.
O: IMP PROBVS AVG, Bust radiate left, almost half-length, seen from front, wearing consular robes and holding eagle-tipped scepter.
R: SOLI INVICTO, Sol raising right hand and holding globe and whip in left, in quadriga of horses leaping left; in exergue, crescent flanked by R and B (officina 2).
Ex Phillip Davis Collection

Another Probus and Sol, but in a metal with a sunnier tone to it...

PROBUS
AV Aureus. 6.28g, 21mm.
Serdica mint, AD 276-282. RIC 829 (R3) corr. (with AVG in rev legend); Biaggi 1640 (this coin); Calicó 4202 (this coin).
O: SOL COMI[S] PROBI AVG, Jugate busts left of Probus, helmeted and cuirassed, holding spear and shield, and of Sol, radiate.
R: SOLI INVICTO COMITI AVG, draped bust of Sol right.
Ex Leo Biaggi de Blasys Collection; ex Münzen und Medaillen AG Basel 19 (1959), lot 250

5 hours ago, Severus Alexander said:

Calling @zumbly... I know he has some very sweet dolphin riders!

Thanks, Sev. I'd somehow missed this thread completely! 

That's a nice one, Curtis... I especially like it when you can see the dolphin-rider's facial features. In Vlasto, it's noted that the issue yours belongs to sports a rider "of plump Dionysiac type." Goes with the grapes, I guess! 😁

It's been a few years since I've been able to add to my dolphin-rider pod, but here are mine:

That's a great halved Nemausus as, Eric, and a very gesture from Q.  Here are two lizardy coins...

MACEDONIA, Eion
Circa 460-400 BC
AR Trihemiobol. 0.83g, 12.4mm.
SNG ANS 287-290.
O: Goose standing right, head reverted; lizard above, H below.
R: Incuse square.
Ex E.E. Clain-Stefanelli Collection

GETA
AE16. 2.53g, 16.5mm.
MOESIA INFERIOR, Nicopolis ad Istrum, AD 198-209.
Varbanov 3217; Hristova-Hoeft-Jekov (2018) 8.22.7.2.
O: Λ ΑΥΡ ΚΑΙ ΓΕΤΑΣ, Bareheaded and draped bust right.
R: ΝΙΚΟΠΟΛΙΤ ΠΡΟΣ ΙΣ, Apollo Sauroktonos standing right with legs crossed, right hand drawn back, placing left hand on tree stump on which a lizard creeps upwards.

I usually just go with the widest too, but as some have pointed out above, for some coins it's better to go with two measurements...

PHOENICIA, Arados
AR Shekel. 10.48g, 23.8mm x 15.4mm min.
Circa 420-400 BC. E&E-A Group III.1.1, C13; HGC 10, 29.
O: Laureate head of Ba’al-Arwad right.
R: Galley right, Pataikos on prow, above waves; M A (in Aramaic) above.

Random #310 is an ex @Steve, a neat open door campgate I adopted which came with a David Sear COA.  A great coin, as just about all ex Steve coins are.... look at that lovely toned silvering!

How about 3 nymphos?

SICILY, Himera (as Thermai Himerensis)
AE Hemilitron. 6.72g, 23.2mm.
SICILY, Himera (as Thermai Himerensis), circa after 252 BC. CNS 22; SNG Cop 323; Sear 1113; Lindgren II 466.
O: Head of Herakles to right, wearing lion skin headress; club on shoulder.
R: ΘΕΡΜΙΤΑΝ, Three nymphs standing facing.

Next: Still the Three Graces

Not sure if this counts, but I "solved" the coin below when I managed to attribute it after buying it unidentified as part of a group lot of ex BCD coins that came with the note that "BCD kept these coins in his collection for decades, not beeing able attributing them! (sic)"

On the other hand, scholars seem to not have been able to nail down exactly which mint produced the type yet.  So, I guess technically it still remains unsolved!  The following note comes from the description of a lot in this past weekend's Obolos auction:

"Several mints have been suggested for this issue - Capua, Minturnae or an uncertain mint in Central Italy. Currently, Minturnae seems the best guess, but further research might change this. Based on overstrikes, Stannard and Sinner (Stannard & Sinner, A central Italian coin with Dionysus/Panther types, and contacts between Central Italy and Spain in the 2nd and 1st centuries BC, Saguntum 46 (2014), p. 161) place this issue around the time of the Social Wars. Its circulation pattern suggests that it was struck by a pro-Roman city or group. It is of great archeological importance in helping to trace trading links between Central Italy and the Baetica region of Spain, where many of the coins are discovered."

LATIUM, Minturnae (?)
AE18. 5.43g, 17.7mm.
LATIUM, Minturnae (?), circa late 90s/early 80s BC. HN III 2672; Lindgren II 190; SNG Copenhagen 342-343; Stannard & Sinner, "A Central Italian coin...", Saguntum 46 (2014), p. 161, 1.  
O: Head of youthful Dionysos to right wearing ivy wreath.
R: Panther to right, holding thyrsos over shoulder.
Ex BCD Collection of Incerta

Next: A coin that you bought unattributed

8 hours ago, JeandAcre said:

Now is when I truly don't know what the hell is going on.  Because when I looked at @Steve and @Zumblyus posts, as above, the first things my shit I saw were the Jelly-Roll Morton and French baroque I'd posted that dumbly long ago.  Whatever.  --Never argue with anyone --or, that much more emphatically, any Thing-- stupider than you are.  You will Always lose.

Anyway, what follows is my initial response.

LOL.  No, I don't understand your musical tastes --any more than I'm supposed to-- but it was fun to see people citing some of the music I like ...in whatever capacity.  (And, No, ditto, except, conversely.)

...For anyone with a little leftover passive-aggressiveness, about Anything, there's always this.  (...Except, I Dare you not to Like the reigning one; at the distance of a smallish ocean and most of a continent, I never can't.)

Hmmm... now I'm the one lost!  Neither Steve nor I quoted your posts.  Software glitch?  😕

Anyway, that Pistols video does bring me back.  Here's one I've always enjoyed, with Sid doing vocal duties. 

Artuqids doing Byzantine their way...

ISLAMIC, Artuqids of Kayfa & Amid
Fakhr al-Din Qara Arslan
AE Dirhem. 3.35g, 23.9mm.
Hisn Kayfa (on the Tigris) mint, circa AD 1148-1174. Spengler & Sayles 1; Album 1820.1.
O: Nimbate bust of Christ Pantokrator facing, wearing tunic and pallium, holding book of Gospels in his left; around, traces of legend.
R: Legend in Kufic naming the laqab of Fakhr al-Din Qara Arslan and his ancestors three generations back.
Notes: Rare issue; obverse type copying Byzantine Class A follis.

ROMAN REPUBLIC
Ti. Quinctius
AR Denarius. 3.83g, 20mm.
Rome mint, 112-111 BC. Crawford 297/1b; Sydenham 563; Quinctia 6.  
O: Laureate bust of Hercules left, seen from behind, wearing lion skin across shoulders, club over right shoulder.  
R: Two horses galloping left; a desultor riding the nearest one; •/X above, rat below; TI and Q; D•S•S incuse on tablet in exergue.
Ex Demetrios Armounta Collection, acquired from Seaby on 12 Sep 1963

Next: More equestrian themed coins

4 hours ago, Steve said:

Ex-stevex6 (now a TIF coin?)

Ol' Captain Caveman is safe and sound with me.  I'm really getting a kick out of seeing you posting your old coins again, btw. Rock on, brother! 😀

PHRYGIA, Hierapolis
AE17. 4.95g, 17.4mm.
PHRYGIA, Hierapolis, pseudo-autonomous, circa 3rd century AD. RPC IV.2 temp no. 2032; SNG Cop 419-20; BMC 19.
O: Draped bust of Selene-Hekate right; behind shoulders, crescent.
R: IEPAΠOΛITΩN, Winged Nemesis standing left, plucking chiton, holding bridle.

Enjoy the game, and may the best team win!  Here's one with an athlete shown taking a victory lap. 

ROMAN REPUBLIC
L. Plaetorius L. f. Cestianus
AR Denarius. 3.9g, 17mm
Rome mint, 67 BC.  Crawford 396/1b; Sydenham 792a; Plaetoria 2.  
O: Diademed and draped bust of Juno Moneta right; MONETA downwards behind, [SC below chin].  
R: Athlete (victorious boxer) running right, holding palm in right hand and wearing ribbons and cestus on left; L PLAETORI downwards behind, L F Q S C upwards before, torch below.
Ex Andrew McCabe Collection; ex Freeman & Sear Mail Bid Sale 12, 28 October 2005

RNG today chose the first coin I ever bought from Harlan Berk, back in August 2013, a Septimius Severus denarius formerly from the collection of @Phil Davis.  I liked the detailed reverse depiction of the emperor in his toga.  You can even see the pointy ends of his corkscrew beard!

SEPTIMIUS SEVERUS
AR Denarius. 3.41g, 19.7mm.
Rome mint, AD 200-201. RIC 160; Cohen 203.
O: SEVERVS AVG PART MAX, laureate head right.
R: FVNDATOR PACIS, Emperor, togate and veiled, standing left holding branch and roll.
Notes: Scarce with this obverse legend: 23 specimens in Reka Devnia hoard.
Ex Phillip Davis Collection

It seems 🏒 was played in Illyria way before it got popular in Canada. 

And from the flames on the obverse, I'm guessing it was the fire hockey variety.  Now, I don't know anything about hockey, but the video below claims fire hockey is "way cooler" than ice hockey? 🤨

#397... because it was a neat chunky chiclet of bronze from Baktria with a triton on it!

BAKTRIA, Indo-Greek Kingdom. Hippostratos
AE Square Octuple Unit. 19.36g, 28.5 x 27.2mm.
Uncertain mint in eastern Gandhara or the western Punjab, circa 65-55 BC. Bopearachchi 12A. HGC 12, 456.
O: ΒΑΣΙΛΕΩΣ - ΣΩΤΗΡΟΣ – ΙΠΠΟΣΤΡΑΤΟΥ, Triton facing, holding dolphin in his right hand and rudder in his left.
R: 'Maharajasa tratarasa Hipusratasa' (in Karoshti), Tyche standing front, head to left, holding lotus flower in her right hand and palm frond in her left; to left, monogram.

CORINTHIA, Corinth
AR Obol. 0.44g, 8.7mm
CORINHIA, Corinth, circa 550 - 500 BC. Weber 3652; cf. BCD Corinth 11 (Pegasos left).  
O: Pegasos flying to right; Q below.  
R: Quadripartite incuse square with swastika pattern.

Next: Another one from Corinth