Cross within cross ?

[Amanda]

I have just noticed that one of my coins has a cross within a cross does anyone know what that means please 

[JeandAcre]

It's an English penny, likeliest to be an Edward IV.  Beyond that, my best guess would be first reign, 1461-1470.  ...This is the high-water mark of the Wars of the Roses, a dynastic context between rival branches of the Planagenets, whose senior line had ended with Richard II (d. 1399).  His predecessor, Henry VI, was restored from late 1470 -early 1471, after which Edward was restored, reigning until 1485. 

From Spink, Coins of England (50th ed., 2015), the initial mark at the top of obverse (indicating date range) is looking most like like a plain cross, c. 1461-4.  But don't take my word for it!  ...The example defies easy classification, either from Spink or the earlier but more comprehensive North.  The cross in the center of the cross evokes issues by various archbishops during the period, with various distinguishing marks, including ones in the center of the reverse cross.  But after checking North, too, this corresponds to none of the listings.

Still more mystifying is that both the initial mark (whether or not I'm reading it right), and the central cross, look to be concave rather than in relief, which is effectively universal in any of these issues.  Inviting the speculation that in both cases, someone put a countermark on the original example.  

...Best you're getting from here.  But it does look like Edward IV.

 

[Amanda]

32 minutes ago, JeandAcre said:

It's an English penny, likeliest to be an Edward IV.  Beyond that, my best guess would be first reign, 1461-1470.  ...This is the high-water mark of the Wars of the Roses, a dynastic context between rival branches of the Planagenets, whose senior line had ended with Richard II (d. 1399).  His predecessor, Henry VI, was restored from late 1470 -early 1471, after which Edward was restored, reigning until 1485. 

From Spink, Coins of England (50th ed., 2015), the initial mark at the top of obverse (indicating date range) is looking most like like a plain cross, c. 1461-4.  But don't take my word for it!  ...The example defies easy classification, either from Spink or the earlier but more comprehensive North.  The cross in the center of the cross evokes issues by various archbishops during the period, with various distinguishing marks, including ones in the center of the reverse cross.  But after checking North, too, this corresponds to none of the listings.

Still more mystifying is that both the initial mark (whether or not I'm reading it right), and the central cross, look to be concave rather than in relief, which is effectively universal in any of these issues.  Inviting the speculation that in both cases, someone put a countermark on the original example.  

...Best you're getting from here.  But it does look like Edward IV.

 

I couldn’t find it when I google by photo so thanks for taking the time to reply, would you have any idea on value please x

[John Conduitt]

The central cross (quatrefoil) on the reverse is from the York mint. It could be almost anyone from Edward I to Henry VII (or even some continental imitation) so you need to be able to either work out some of the obverse lettering, any symbols by the bust, or what form the crown takes. But it looks damaged and the photos aren't clear enough to tell.

Unless it's Richard III, it's not worth a lot.

Edited April 24 by John Conduitt

[JeandAcre]

...Aaah, I'm finally seeing it, @John Conduitt.  That is a quatrefoil; I was merely looking at the spaces between the borders, which are on the worn side of life.  But, yes, any example with a central device in the reverse cross is going to be an ecclesiastical issue.  Those don't begin until the reign of Edward III.

What led me to Edward IV were the first two, barely /ostensibly legible letters of the obverse, which more closely resemble "ED" than any of the available alternatives over the entire interval.  And the style of the crown, which looked more 15th than 14th century.  Given the heroic level of wear, I arrived at Edward IV by a simple process of elimination.  

Edited April 25 by JeandAcre

[Amanda]

Someone has said to me that the coin was struck by the archbishops mint and not the royal York mint ??? Is that something that happened often? Would you have any idea of value also please x

[John Conduitt]

3 hours ago, Amanda said:

Someone has said to me that the coin was struck by the archbishops mint and not the royal York mint ??? Is that something that happened often? Would you have any idea of value also please x

The archbishop(s) struck all the coins in York from Edward III to Henry VI.