Benefactor kirispupis Posted March 1 · Benefactor Benefactor Share Posted March 1 As part of my Kingdoms After Alexander collection, I've been after an Elymais example for some time. When I first started looking, issues were relatively rare and expensive. Then, maybe a year ago, it seems a hoard was discovered. The prices have dropped considerably and Roma seems to have cornered the market in including several in each auction, though I've seen them at other auctions and stores too. In fact, so many have hit the market lately that I had to pause to think which one I wanted. When this one hit, I felt it was a pretty good example and it looks even better in hand. Kings of Elymais, Kamnaskires III, with Anzaze Seleukeia on the Hedyphon dated SE 233 = 80/79 BCE AR Tetradrachm 15.89g, 27mm, 12h Conjoined busts of Kamnaskires and Queen Anzaze to left; Seleukid anchor terminating in monogram behind Zeus seated to left, holding sceptre and Nike, who crowns him; IΛCIΛEΩ[C] [KΛ]MNΛCKIIOY [...]IΛCIΛHHIH ANZAZH around, [MAK]EΔ[ΩN] to inner left, ГΛΣ (sic, date) in exergue. Van't Haaff Type 7.1.1-1-2 (date unlisted); Alram 454 (date unlisted); Roma E-103, 597 (same dies); Sunrise -; DCA 518. Ex Roma Numismatics For Elymais, I did break a trend where I've tried to collect the founder or at least the earliest monarch who minted coins. In cases like the Pontic Kingdom, I went with Mithridates VI since the earlier rulers are in the stratosphere. However, for Elymais - though as I understand Kamnaskires I issues are expensive, there are some Kamnaskires II examples that are possible. However, I just couldn't pass on this obverse. The coin is simply so striking IMHO that I made an exception. More intriguing I find is that relatively little is known about the Kingdom of Elymais. Its coins are common, but that's mostly all we know about it. There are a few inscriptions that hint at the history, and we believe it gained and lost it sovereignty against the Seleukid and then Parthian empires. At the time, it was highly unusual for a queen to be depicted on a coin with her husband. However, from at least my research it appears that we know next to nothing about Anzaze. Was she influential at court, or was Kamnaskires completely enamored with her? We don't seem to know. What I also find intriguing is the mix of Hellenistic and Persian imagery. The reverse is almost straight out of a Hellenistic coin (the stringy Nike being the most blatant difference), but the obverse is closer to the Persian theme - though different in its own way. To me, that's part of the intrigue of these coins. They're certainly not rare, but they're practically the only windows we have into an otherwise unknown country. Post your examples of Elymais! 21 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nerosmyfavorite68 Posted March 1 · Member Share Posted March 1 That's really cool! I myself was thinking of purchasing that type last year. I didn't end up buying it because it was some dealer in Dubai whom I was unfamiliar with (it wasn't Zurqieh) and I was hesitant to take the chance on a coin costing a few hundred dollars. Yes, that is a truly impressive type. Well done! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniard Posted March 1 · Supporter Share Posted March 1 @kirispupis..That's a wonderful looking example!..Well centred both sides with what looks to be nice toning...Congrats. No silver here but I do have this well detailed for type bronze drachm. Orodes III, 2nd Century A.D., AE Drachm 3.5 grams Obv: Bearded bust facing left, wearing a diademed tiara ornamented with anchor. Pellet and crescent above an anchor to the right. Rev: Radiate and draped bust of Artemis right. Greek legend around bust retrograde van't Haaff 16.1.1-3A Attributed by BobL 16 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniard Posted March 2 · Supporter Share Posted March 2 Here's a couple more of these sweet, cheap little bronzes.. Kamnaskires-Orodes..13-15mm/3.6gr Early to mid 2nd century AD Van’t Haaff 12.3.1-2A2 Obv: Bust with top hair tuft, upward side tufts, one crossbar on anchor, pellet within crescent at upper right Rev: Dashes with regular pattern Phraates bronze drachm, weight 3.6gr..15 mm diameter Obverse.. ΦPA, Bearded bust left wearing tiara with pellet in crescent; pellet inside crescent above anchor with one crossbar right. Reverse.. BACIΛEVC ΠPAATHC (blundered), Artemis standing right, not radiate, drawing arrow from quiver on shoulder with right hand, bow in left. Vant Haaff 14.6.1-3; 15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nerosmyfavorite68 Posted March 2 · Member Share Posted March 2 It's a spectacular type and really deserves more than 71 views. Hopefully, this will give it a little bump. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanxi Posted March 3 · Supporter Share Posted March 3 KINGS of ELYMAIS. Kamnaskires V. Circa 54/3-33/2 BCE. AR/BI Drachm (3.77 g, 12h). Seleukeia on the Hedyphon mint. Uncertain date. Obv.: Diademed bust left; behind anchor Rev.: Diademed bust left; [date off flan]. Ref.: van’t Haaff Type 9.1.2-6A (picture: Kölner Münzkabinett) Kingdom of Elymais Uncertain early Arsacid king Æ tetradrachm Obv.: Bust facing right, pointed beard, curly hair dressed in a curved pattern Rev.: crude style bust left, degraded legend Æ, 15.18g, 30 mm Ref.: Van´t Haaff Type 10.2, Subtype 1-1 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniard Posted March 3 · Supporter Share Posted March 3 @shanxi..Great looking Kamnaskires V drachm!..Any idea who's being portrayed on the reverse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanxi Posted March 3 · Supporter Share Posted March 3 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Spaniard said: Any idea who's being portrayed on the reverse? Unfortunately NO. It's not the king, because the beard is much shorter. Sometimes you can read Heracles, but I find this hard to believe. So it's better to stay with "male bust with diadem". It's often difficult to tell who is on the reverse. Here is another difficult example. Even with a legend. Kingdom of Elymais Orodes IV 2nd half 2nd Century Æ Drachm Obv.: Bust facing left Large Hair tufts at Top and Side of Head; Legend "KING ORODES" Rev.: Female Bust to left; Long Hair lock falling down; Legend "ULFAN" Æ, 3.71 g, 14mm. Ref.: Van´t Haaff Type 17.1, Subtype 1-1c THIS COIN Ex Van't Haaff Collection Edited March 3 by shanxi 8 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamnaskires Posted March 3 · Member Share Posted March 3 On 3/1/2023 at 2:27 PM, kirispupis said: When I first started looking, issues were relatively rare and expensive. Then, maybe a year ago, it seems a hoard was discovered. Indeed. It would seem that several huge hoards must have been discovered over the past five years or so. There was a time when these Kamnaskires III/Anzaze tets were going for many thousands - even up to $15,000 or so. But then a bunch of them hit the market, and have continued to do so since. Recently, within the past half year, an incredible number of previously rare and quite expensive Kamnaskires V issues - across all denominations - has been prevalent on the market, across multiple sellers and auction houses. It's a good time - the best time ever, actually - to pick up some Elymaean AR. To contribute to the pile on, here's an AE tet from one of the early Arsacid Dynasty kings of Elymais: Uncertain Early Arsacid Kings AE tetradrachm, late 1st century BC to early 2nd century AD Van’t Haaff 10.1.1-1 And for something very different. The Elymaeans are believed to have been descended from the more ancient Elamites. Here is an arrowhead from Elam: AE Arrowhead Elam Neo-Elamite II or III period: c. 750 – 600 BC 50 mm (2”) 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted March 3 · Supporter Share Posted March 3 Coins from Elymais have a certain Ozymandian charm. Mine are not special, but I like them: Kingdom of Elymais, Orodes II, early to mid 2nd c. AD, AE Drachm. Obv: Bearded bust of Orodes facing, wearing tiara, no large hair tufts at sides; to right, pellet in crescent and anchor with two crossbars. Rev: dashes. Ref: van't Haaff 13.3.2–1B. 15 mm, 4g. Kingdom of Elymais, Orodes V, late 2nd–early 3rd c. AD, AE Drachm. Obv: Bearded bust of Orodes left with double diadem and tuft of hair on top of head. Rev: Bust of Artemis with beaded tiara left. Ref: van't Haaff 18.1.1-2A. 13 mm, 2.6g. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benefactor kirispupis Posted March 3 · Benefactor Author Benefactor Share Posted March 3 2 hours ago, Kamnaskires said: Indeed. It would seem that several huge hoards must have been discovered over the past five years or so. There was a time when these Kamnaskires III/Anzaze tets were going for many thousands - even up to $15,000 or so. But then a bunch of them hit the market, and have continued to do so since. Recently, within the past half year, an incredible number of previously rare and quite expensive Kamnaskires V issues - across all denominations - has been prevalent on the market, across multiple sellers and auction houses. It's a good time - the best time ever, actually - to pick up some Elymaean AR. And for something very different. The Elymaeans are believed to have been descended from the more ancient Elamites. Here is an arrowhead from Elam: AE Arrowhead Elam Neo-Elamite II or III period: c. 750 – 600 BC 50 mm (2”) No wonder the kingdom went under! Their arrowheads were crooked! Now that I think of it, I was probably wise to pick up a Kamnaskires III instead of a Kamnaskires II. I just need to wait for them to keep digging. 🙂 Eventually they'll reach a hoard of Kamnaskires II. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamnaskires Posted March 4 · Member Share Posted March 4 Given that posts about Elymais are rarer than any of the coins in the series, I feel obligated to keep this thread going. On 3/1/2023 at 2:27 PM, kirispupis said: ...we know next to nothing about Anzaze. Was she influential at court, or was Kamnaskires completely enamored with her? Perhaps it wasn't love, after all. David Salaris, in his 2017 publication The Kingdom of Elymais (ca. 301 BC - 224 AD) makes the case that the union of Kamnaskires III and Anzaze - and the showy display of them together on the coinage - was, essentially, for political expediency. It thus may have been a marriage of convenience. He returns to this point several times in the text. Here are some excerpts for anyone (admittedly, it will be a very small few) who may find this interesting. Page 93: "The figure of Anzaze is still obscure. Her presence could indicate the necessity of pointing out particular affiliations with a well-recognizable local figure within an established dynastic context (possibly an endogamy relationship)‚ or the political inter-dynastic union with the member of a powerful agro-pastoral community present in the highlands. After a 50-year gap from the last Elymaean emission of Tigraios (133/2 BC), the exigency of a dynastic reaffirmation from an iconographic perspective would have probably represented a clear propagandistic obligation." Page 316: "The entire coinage of the Late Kamnaskirids reveals the desire to mark a dynastic emphasis‚ an example of genealogical transposition inaugurated with Kamnaskires III. The juxtaposition of the latter with the female figure of Anzaze may indicate a necessary connection with an important personage within a dynastic context‚ maybe related to an endogamy relationship, a form of royal legitimacy possibly inherited by the ancient Elamite culture." Page 361: "The necessity to re-affirm a genealogical connection with the first Kamnaskires rulers appears a dominant theme for the Late Kamnaskires (1st century BC). Iconographically‚ the representation of Kamnaskires III and Anzaze may indicate the association with a major dynastic personage (possibly an endogamy relationship)‚ or the political union with the member of a powerful agro-pastoral polity present in the highlands." 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZ Numismatics Posted March 4 · Member Share Posted March 4 Someone needs to solve the mystery of the enigmatic dashes. Those things have been bothering me for years. What the hell do they mean??!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edessa Posted March 5 · Supporter Share Posted March 5 Missed opportunity. I worked in Kuwait during the mid-1990's for a couple of years. A dealer at the antique souk had buckets of these small coppers for 3KD (about $8 at the time). I probably could have purchased bags at a large discount. However, they were mixed in with more recent hammered Indian issues and I did not recognize these as ancient. Dummy new collector. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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