seth77

Tell you what it looks like to me: - the last two coins 'Smyrna phase 2' Temp 847 and the 1st issue Cyzicus are both Cyzicus issues - the type 847 in general is Smyrna, but on the coin you posted (FAC coin) the obverse is Cyzicus to my eyes, early SPQR series early 269 rather than Smyrna - the reverse die on the other hand is possibly Smyrna - which would make perfect sense if the operation moved from Smyrna to Cyzicus, such 'continuation' of older dies is to be expected - I don't think the two are obverse die-matches, if you check out the imaginary line from the tip of Claudius nose to the legend on the obverse on the SPQR coin the line would end mid S of CLAVDIVS while on the no mark coin just after the S, but they are certainly very close - a die sharing between SPQR and no mark would probably suggest what you mentioned above, the SPQR operation moved to Cyzicus while the no marking operation was undergoing there, so the 1st emission of Cyzicus could in theory be contemporary with the last SPQR coins struck at Smyrna, the physical moving of the operation, cutters paraphernalia, including used dies, and the first coins struck with SPQR at Cyzicus probably late winter-early spring 269 All in all that FAC coin is really interesting.

That would explain the rarity, not just the design. And with such a multitude of types being struck by the German mints, I wonder why the attribution to Mainz or Verdun. Does it show stilistic characteristics to those mints? And if Theophanou's coinage one would assume that it was tied to her personally rather than a local mint, no?

The presence of Theophanou and her entourage, court and artisans is a very elegant and likely explanation for this "Byzantine" German coinage. I also think that the coin is likely pre-1000 considering the style and flan. What does it measure/weigh?

This is a coinage from the first part of the 1270s probably. The denier tournois is introduced to the Frankokratia in the 1260s, with coinage imported from the Occitan and Provencal areas following the interdiction of the deniers tournois of Alphonse de France and Charles d'Anjou by Louis IX of France. This smaller title and lighter denier tournois was the blueprint for the Greek denier tournois, which was likely started by Guillaume II de Villehardouin around 1267, after the Viterbo treaty, when Guillaume entered the orbit of Charles d'Anjou in his push eastward. The Frankish coinage did in fact reach the Eastern Levant, up to the coast of Israel, Lebanon and Syria and even the Greek variations were used in the late and very late stages of the 'Crusader' principalities in the Holy Land and Syria. In fact the coinage started in 1267 (but with the bulk minting around 1270+) was back to France by the early 1300s to supplant the lack of good billon coinage during the debasement and inflation crisis that gave Philippe IV the moniker of 'roi faux monnayeur'. And not only that, but the coinage was so successful that it ended up being adopted by the Eastern Empire itself in the form of the 'tornesion' (after the reform of 1304 that re-introduced silver in the Byzantine monetary system) and the 'politikon' (the silver local Constantinopolitan denomination by mid 14th century). If we were to follow its other manifestations as 'monnaie noire' based on the tornesii of Giovanni II Orsini of Arta that were copied and used extensively throughout the Balkans, the Danube trade and the Bulgarian and Byzantine Black Sea on one hand and the tornesii of the Maona di Chio minted by the Genoese corporation for the Aegean trade, the career of this coinage goes well to the mid 16th century. That being said, if you want to actively collect these coins, there are many variations and many mints to be found, especially easy the 3 main Greek mints of Glarentza (CLARENTIA/CLARENCIA like your coin) for the Principality of Achaea, Thebes for the Duchy of Athens (you can read my numismatic synopsis of the denier tournois of the Duchy of Athens here) and Naupaktos/Lepanto for the Angevin Despotate of Epirus, a Latin breakaway realm carved from the Epirus of the Komnenodoukai. To follow all variations, you can check the library your father left you for Malloy's main work (ed.) - Coins of the Crusader States. Additionally I find the following works very helpful: - Tzamalis - Coins of the Frankish Occupation of Greece 1184-1566. - Baker - Coinage and Money in Medieval Greece 1200-1430 I for one love this part of European history that combines and mixes the West and the East in a complex and eclectic manner, bringing the feudal system and the expeditionary ethos of the Western barons and the Catholic Church to the centralized forms of power and the dynamic diplomacy and soft power of the Byzantine Empire during the Komnenodoukai of Epirus-Thessalonica and the Palaiologai. Medieval Greece is extremely complex and thanks to the extremely influential monetary move made by Guillaume de Villehardouin, numismatics plays a great role in understanding this story. Last but not least, the paperwork that your father saved makes this coin very interesting and desirable. You have there Malloy's notes and the publication of the catalog that gives your coin its pedigree. As a student of the Greek Frankokratia and of the denier tournois, I can say that I really appreciate seeing the coin with the documentation together. Hope you'll get some of the enjoyment your dad certainly got when collecting it (otherwise he wouldn't had kept it all together) from this coin. Here is a contemporary:

The nummii minimi of Anastasius c. 491-8, the last 'late Roman coinage' before the introduction of the M/K/I/E/B denominations. AE8mm 0.7g AE8mm 0.72g AE9mm 0.69g

Yes, he was still posting on CT every once in a while, some of my purchases were directly inspired by his "dear friends of ancient mythology" posts

I have been returning often, now that I am studying 'Greek Imperial' or 'provincials' to read 20 year old threads from Patricia Lawrence (slokind) and Jochen. Back then I was too young and immature to understand the precious knowledge and insights they were dropping.

jdholds (Jerome Holderman) from Forvm was probably the first person I ever bought an oversea coin from. And then or possibly simultaneously, there was Kevin Sands (Mayadigger on Forvm) who also had a commercial site in the early 2000s where he usually sold uncleaned coins. I would buy an assortment of a few coins from his green, cruddy, orange and 'Balkan' categories and he always used to add extra coins. I also remember the big controversy surrounding 'monneron' and his 'hoard' of Constantinian AE3s that where heavily dissected online and either condemned as fakes or accepted by others as very nice authentic coins. I also remember that back then a good siliqua was 50$ and lots of British siliquae clipped could be had for 20-30£ and shipping with Registered Royal Mail was probably the fastest in Europe, even faster than Deutsche Post.

Me: I'm gonna use this weekend to research some backlogs and add them to the database. Me this weekend:

Excellent coins and so fitting for a specialist collection. I find particular interest in the first one because it makes me wonder on the chronology of the Cyzicus imperial mint. The style and the flan look so different than what we see in the SPQR series moved from Smyrna. I wonder if there wasn't a very early phase at Cyzicus in early 269 that minted this coin and probably other reverse types, possibly with personnel from Europe. And afterwards, sometime later that year the minting operation from Smyrna moves to Cyzicus focusing on a few SPQR types that had been evolving from the very late Gallienus and very early Claudius II SPQR types. This is interesting because where would that leave the M - C coinage that was struck briefly also in 269 at Cyzicus "mid 269" cf. Estiot & Mairat. The pictures looks very cluttered at Cyzicus at its start as an Imperial mint, with 3 different coinages that seem to have continued for a few months until that 'mid 269' after which at least the M - C coinage stops and the no marking coinage seems to adopt the SPQR types. Here's an example of the M - C coinage that I haven't posted anywhere yet, with Claudius in an ornate cuirass and holding his spear over his right shoulder:

Baduila AE5mm 0.24g nummus

I bet nobody's interested in seeing some grotty Cherson 'maiorinae' for Theodosius II after seeing all these beauties.

A small 13mm 2.14g brassy 'leaded bronze' unit minted at Lampsacus in Mysia for Augustus: And who's that on the reverse? It's the ithyphallic Priapus with his erection, luckily preserved in full despite the overall worn and corroded condition of the coin.

Yes, I remember him from FAC circa 20years ago. I remember his posts along with Curtis Clay's, Pat Lawrence's and Jochen's were real gems. I had to really grow and learn to appreciate them. Mark Fox was also the one to announce the coinage of Taenarum/Tainaron last year. I can do you one better, check your PM.

One of the inspirations for my interest in coins comes from numismatic literature. Whenever I get the chance I either read online or buy periodicals and articles from throughout Europe to Israel and the US. My favorite type of articles is what I have been also trying to emulate in my entries here and in my papers for numismatic periodicals: interesting pieces of puzzle with questions and (less often) answers regarding dating and the historical implications of certain coinages. An article that I have read the past month caught my interest not only for the subject matter but also for the periodical outlet that published it: 'Two numismatic puzzles from 1st century Sestus' by Mark Fox in 'Archaeology of the first millennium A.D. IV. Nomads and the autochtonous in the first millennium A.D.' (Istros, 2015), pp. 33-47. A numismatist from the US featured in an Eastern European (Romanian) publication. Surely a result of one of the great feats of the internet age -- fast interconnectivity and access to information for all interested parties. As I have mentioned a few times, I consider the local researchers to be the best when it comes to latest info, theories and finds regarding particular types. At the same time, internet, ebay and (in the last few years) biddr have given us all a chance to be as close as the 'locals' in numismatic research, as Mark Fox proves beyond any doubt in his research. So, a few days after reading his fun article, browsing the inventory of one of my favorite auction houses, lo and behold one of the coins Mr. Fox focuses in his paper: AE18 4.48g copper unit minted c. 70-81? [Δ]OMI[TIA]N[O]Σ KAIΣAP; laureate head r. ΣHΣ - TIwN; lyre/cithara RPC I 1739 / RPC II 358 double die-match with RPC II 358A It's a very interesting coin from an area of the Thracian Chersonesos less prolific during the Imperial age. It was assigned in RPC (RPC I) to Augustus (initially). BMC on the other hand had it assigned to Domitian. M. Fox in his aforementioned article suggests that the coin is actually minted for Domitian, and notes that it was likely minted early during his reign. Another possibility, even more likely considering the characteristics emphasized by M. Fox -- the form of the ethnic name on the reverse and the shape of the cithara, both very similar to Sestos issues for Vespasian (RPC II 358) -- coupled with the early form of sigma (Σ) instead of the regular (C) that is even used on the coinage of Vespasian, would suggest an issue very close to 70AD, so possibly minted for Domitian as Caesar rather than as Augustus (after 81). Without the paper to take up the problem of assigning this unremarkable coin in a context more suitable for its characteristics and as such, closer to its true attribution, I likely would've not become interested in this spec and my knowledge in 'provincial' or 'Greek Imperial' numismatics would have been poorer.

There is that and then there is our colleague @Prieure de Sion who has got his material underappreciated and undersold.

Ah, that really is promising.

I really like the way your dad recorded everything with such attention to detail, like a professional historian. This period is not really in my focus, I am interested in mostly post-1204 -- breakaway Greek states after the 4th Crusade and Latin Empire + Palaiologan age. But I could add something on this coin: it's the first billon issue for Manuel c. 1143-1152.

Even his moniker Paul Bearer is funny. In related news, I seem to have been missing out by not being up to date with this thing.

Had no idea who the guy was and had to go look for him on Google lol. The whole Wrestling scene is something from American culture that is totally unfamiliar to me. I will use that gif on my whatsapp and other gif-supporting comm apps even if no one gets the reference just because it's funny regardless, by its own self lol.

Ah, across the pond things.

What is that gif from I'd like to use it in my day-to-day online communications.

Probably Goa'uld nearby, Jaffa Kree!

Great coins but damn the cat in that gif is beautiful.

They work well together too, showing the two phases of the base metal mint: Greek local/provincial and Latin colonial.