Sol_Invictus

This is very sad news indeed. I enjoyed reading Terrance's posts and seeing his coins. 

In the immortal lyrics of the Seikilos epitaph

Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ
πρὸς ὀλίγον ἔστι τὸ ζῆν
τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.

translated on Wikipedia as:

While you live, shine
have no grief at all
life exists only for a short while
and Time demands his due

The date range spanned by the coinage is astounding! Apparently the hoard contains Ban Liang coins from the second century BC all the way through Song dynasty coins from the 13th century AD!

Thanks for sharing @Al Kowsky! Any relation between The Renaissance Shop that you founded in Santa Barbara and Renaissance Antiques which is just up the 101 in Solvang, CA?

16 minutes ago, DonnaML said:

But I would think that the British Museum already owned all or most of the stolen jewelry long before this person's tenure. So I don't think the failure to record the items in their collection can be laid at his door. Clearly, he targeted these items because they weren't recorded in inventory. 

Good point.

If the person responsible for recording the objects was also the person who was stealing them, then perhaps it’s not the museum’s fault for not having records of the items. Instead their fault is in trusting the wrong person, and in not keeping a sufficiently close eye on their staff.

Amazing find! I have also heard, and assumed it was true, that there were no coins minted in Cicero’s name. It’s incredible to see this example, though I won’t be adding it to my target list 🙃

Thanks for starting this discussion @Salomons Cat! I always find it very interesting to read about the different approaches that people have. For myself, I set a strict annual budget. I find using an annual budget gives a little more flexibility for occasionally buying expensive coins that would be well over my monthly budget. In practice I usually end up with more money saved up in my budget at the end of the year for a bigger purchase.

3 hours ago, ewomack said:

A part of me definitely misses the days of driving to the local coin shop, deciding on something tasty in their inventory, buying it, and then taking it home with me instantaneously. If anything happened to the item(s) in transit, I had no one to blame but myself.

Funny enough the only coin I’ve lost to date was a liberty head dime I purchased at a coin store, which somehow fell out of my pocket before I got home with it. 

Apparently there were contemporary Bulgarian imitations of anonymous follises as well, e.g.: https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=3666301

Here are some other very crude contemporary imitations that were listed as being from uncertain mints:

https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=8103846

https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=5721579
 

https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=9336134

None of these really look like yours though…

Seems random to me. My last coin that came through NY customs about a month ago went right through in maybe a day, while the ones before that took about a week. Maybe it depends on if the items are flagged for more careful inspection?

This article shows the eBay listing for one of the items alleged to have been stolen from the BM.

https://www.theartnewspaper.com/2023/08/18/media-reports-identify-objects-stolen-from-the-british-museum-posted-on-ebay

I guess EBay seller associated with this was Sultan1966

It depends on which countries you’re exporting from and importing into, but there are countries that restrict coins from time periods that are rather recent. For example, if you are importing coins into the U.S. that were minted in Turkey the import restrictions apply all the way up to the date 1770 A.D.

My collection is all low value coins, so I suspect I would have to sell them to a dealer rather than through an auction. In that case I’d probably be lucky to get a quarter of what I paid for it. Maybe eBay would be better, but I’m doubtful I would have much success there either as I have no eBay reputation. I keep track of how much I have spend on every coin, and know how much total I have spent, but I always consider this to be money spent for good.

These are incredible photos and stories, thanks so much for sharing!  Just the other day I saw an exhibit on Stanley Troutman, a correspondent for the Acme news agency during WWII, who took a number photographs for the Newspaper pool from the battles of Saipan, Corregidor, and others, as well as of the aftermath of Hiroshima, and Nagasaki. Amazingly he lived to be 101, and only passed away in 2020. Probably the most compelling part of the exhibit was watching a video of him, filmed in 2019, sharing some of his recollections. Being a photographer during the war seems to have been an incredibly harrowing job; I can’t imagine the amount of bravery required by your grandfather and others in similar positions. That’s amazing that your family has some of these unpublished photographs of such historical importance! I’m sure there would be museums or other institutions that would be interested in them.

My guess is a Nero sestertius in VF condition.

Money laundering?

One thing I like about Frank’s photos is that they are scaled to the relative size of each coin. I enjoy browsing through his listings and seeing all the different coin sizes in comparison. I do agree though that it’d be nice if they were higher resolution. I’m reluctant to bid more than ~$100 on coins in his auctions for that reason.

I keep my coins in trays, so I see the coins in the top tray every day, and am not infrequently motivated to pull out the lower trays as well. I also let my grade school kids take out the coins and hold them and look at them whenever they want (which is probably once every few weeks; I do make them wash and thoroughly dry their hands first). Whenever we learn about anything from history, say in a library book or in a movie/show that they watch, it’s nice to be able to pull out a relevant coin. I think having some tangible artifact from different time periods and places helps me, and my kids, appreciate that these were real events that happened to real people, and to better remember what we learn. I also like to keep the coins in chronological order, mixing everything from around the world together, which I think helps to visualize where different historical groups and people fit into the broader history of human civilization.  I think this has helped my youngest, especially, learn about the reckoning of time, and to realize that there is a vast history of people who came before us. Since we live in a part of the US where there is very little in the way of historical structures and ruins that one encounters on an everyday basis, I feel especially compelled to provide my kids with some exposure to the past.

Interesting article, thanks for sharing! Surely the Turkish government must have a larger “collection” though in storage somewhere. 

Here are a couple coins I have purchased this year for between $50 and $100 (total, including shipping, fees, etc):

Arab-Byzantine, Umayyad Caliphate, Caliph 'Abd al-Malik, 685-705 AD. AE Fals, Dimashq mint, 21mm, ~3 grams

Obv: Caliph standing with sword in hand. Arabic legend.

Rev: Modified cross (qutb?) on steps. Arabic legend.

Album 3540; Goodwin 706; ex. Wayne G Sayles 2023. ex James Theselius Collection.

Purchased for a little over $50 from Wayne G Sayles earlier this year. The photo above is Mr. Sayles'. The coin looks quite a bit better in hand, but I haven't been able to capture a better photo of it myself.

Azes I, Indo-Scythian Kingdom, 58 - 12 BC. AE Tetradrachm, 29mm, 12.92 grams.

Obv: BAΣIΛEΩΣ BAΣIΛEΩN MEΓAΛOY / AZOY Bull standing right; above, monogram.

Rev: 'Maharajasa rajadhirajasa mahatasa / Ayasa' ('of Great King, King of Kings, Azes the Great' in Kharoshthi) Lion standing right; above, monogram.

HGC 12, 657; Senior 102; ex. Leu Numismatik Web Auction 25, 2023, lot 1269. ex. Dr Björn-Uwe Abels collection. ex. Robert Tye 2010

Purchased at recent Leu auction for about $75 (including shipping and fees, and conversion to from CHF to USD). The photos above are from Leu Numismatik.

According to the terms and conditions for the latest cgb.fr auction:

“3.6 Export: In the case of coins that are dated prior to 1500 with a unitary value above 3,000 Euros, French law relating to the protection of cultural property requires us always to apply to the Ministry of Culture for an export certificate (and an export licence for countries outside the EU). The time period for obtaining these documents is usually about 8 to 10 weeks. Certificates issued are valid indefinitely.”

So I gather the value is now 3000 euro for requiring a French export license.

So many lovely coins in this thread!  Here are a few modest ones:

Judea, Portius Festus, 58-59 AD, AE Prutah, 18mm, ~3 grams

Obv: Palm-branch surrounded by KAICAPO and date.

Rev: NEP/WNO/C, legend in wreath tied at bottom.

ex. David Connors

Carthaginian Sicily, 330 - 320 BC, AE15, Uncertain mint in Sicily. 15mm, 15.0 grams.

Obv: Palm tree with two date clusters.

Rev: Pegasos flying to the left

ex. Roma Numismatics.

I have a 8 Reales coin of Carlos IV that may have a similar chopmark on the reverse to the one shown in the e-bay listing. The chopmark in question is on the column to the left of the shield. The upper left arm of the swastika, if that's what it is, is missing, possibly because it extended off of the column. I must admit that I do have a strong negative gut-level reaction to seeing these, even though intellectually I know that this mark, made in this context, would have symbolized Buddha's footprint, and have had absolutely nothing to do with the Third Reich (which wouldn't even exist until the subsequent century anyway).

Excellent post, and congrats on winning such an interesting coin at such a low price!

3 hours ago, DonnaML said:

 

It seems to me that there's some room for argumentation in this list: the Eid Mar aureus, for example, was not a "Roman Provincial" coin that "circulated primarily in Turkey." So even if hypothetically some Roman soldier brought an Eid Mar aureus (or indeed any Roman Republican or Roman Imperial coin, or any Roman Provincial coin that primarily circulated in, say, Syria) to Anatolia and lost it or spent it there, and it were discovered in Turkey 2,000 years later, I would argue that any such coin should not, by the terms of the MOU, be subject to its restrictions despite having been found in Turkey and exported from Turkey without a permit.

I may not understand this correctly, but I thought that if there is convincing evidence that a particular coin was found in Turkey and was exported without a permit, then whether or not the MOU applies is irrelevant. The US (and possibly other governments as well) would consider it stolen property of Turkey and would return it to Turkey. The MOU serves to define a set of coins that US customs *assumes* to be Turkish government property unless proven otherwise (by providing an export license from Turkey, or proving that to it was out of Turkey before the MOU went into effect). This I think is one of the unjust aspects of these MOUs - Turkey doesn’t have to prove that it’s their coin to take it, you have to prove it isn’t theirs to keep it.

I don’t think the EID MAR aureus is covered by the US MOU with Greece (which I thought actually excludes gold coins, and only covers coins minted in Greece anyway). So presumably it was returned to Greece not because of the MOU, but because there is some compelling evidence it was found in Greece and exported without a license.