Anaximander Posted December 6, 2024 · Member Posted December 6, 2024 (edited) Here's a French-issued penny dating to the period of King Edward II. Here's a penny of King Edward I. Or is it? Trade between England and the continent in the Edwardian (Plantagenet) era (1272 to 1369) relied on payment in cash and in kind. European sellers returned from English fairs with goods and good English pennies. Since the French currency had been heavily debased on the 13th century, merchants sought out English-standard coinage. They even made their own, usually minted with a similar (but rarely full) fineness. These feudal 'Edwardian Imitations' were widespread as trade coinage in the north and north-east of France, in Aquitaine (southwest France), and in the low countries. Nicholas Mayhew wrote about these 'Sterling Imitations of Edwardian Type' in 1983 in his Royal Numismatic Society Special Publication #14. Some were just similar looking. Legends would differ from the true English pennies: they could carry the name of a French lord, like Charles the Bad (le mauvais, el malo) (!) from Navarre. Many featured crowned busts like the English coins they imitated, but others were uncrowned or featured a circlet of roses and were known as 'pollards and crockards.' Pollards: a bare-headed bust, facing. In English, it means a cow without horns (example). Crockards: the bust wears a 'chaplet of roses' aka 'denarius rosades' That style was derided as 'crocardus' or 'cocodonis' (French for fashion doll or dandy. Example). Because these coins were usually struck to lesser fineness, Edward I began to crack down on these imitations, eventually banning them outright. Circulation in England of the obviously foreign issues effectively ceased after 1300, but close imitations with crowned kings and English legends became the norm. My French imitation was not really trying to pass as a bona-fide English penny, though plenty were, especially the later issues. James Roberts (The Silver Coins of Medieval France, 476-1610 AD) lists dozens of such imitations from France, the Low Countries, Germany, and even Norway. My penny of Edward I is real. At least, I think it is! Edited December 7, 2024 by Anaximander Added Wikipedia link for Charles the (very, very) Bad. 7 2 Quote
Nerosmyfavorite68 Posted December 6, 2024 · Member Posted December 6, 2024 Quite interesting! I enjoyed learning something new. 1 1 Quote
JAZ Numismatics Posted December 6, 2024 · Member Posted December 6, 2024 Well you made me look up "Charles the Bad," apparently earning the nickname for his numerous mistresses and illegitimate children, not to mention his vacillating loyalty between France and England. He sounds like a lot of fun at a party, but not not someone you could trust with even an old pair of socks. 1 1 Quote
Lhevae Posted December 7, 2024 · Member Posted December 7, 2024 The sterling / esterlins are an interesting coinage. Some were really imitative of Edwardian types but they also developed their own designs. On that esterlin of Jean II d'Avesnes (Hainaut), struck in Mons, the crown is not the royal one but the count's. Fairly interesting design on that esterlin of Jean III of Brabant, struck in Brussels. Another one from Hainaut, with the monogram of the county, struck under William I. 8 2 Quote
John Conduitt Posted December 7, 2024 · Supporter Posted December 7, 2024 That's an interesting coin. I suppose they thought striking coins that look like Edward's would make everyone think their coins were as pure, but as you say, the coin tells you it isn't English. Continental imitations started under Henry III (I don't know if anyone would have wanted to copy coins of Stephen or Richard I). I think this one is trying to be deceptive. Henry III Class 2a Long Cross Continental Imitation Penny, 1248-1252 Westphalia. Silver, 19mm, 1.38g. Facing bust without sceptre; heNKICVS R NX • I' with pomme letter X (used on Germanic imitations). Long cross; HI /OL /OIIL/VID - retrograde and outwards (based on Nicole On Lund). (North 10, this coin). Ex JJ North. This is an imitation of Edward III from Bavaria, an 'esterlin', but they were called Lushbournes as they originated in Luxembourg. The eagle gives it away if the legends haven't, but the bust is difficult to tell apart from the real ones. Louis IV of Bavaria Esterlin, 1325-1328 Aachen. Silver, 1.17g. Crowned bust facing; +LVDOVICVS⋮ROM⋮RЄX. Long cross pattée and pellets with eagle in first quadrant; MOn / ЄTA / AQVЄ / nSIS (Mayhew 332). Oddly, while the French copied English coins, the English copied French jetons. They struck some of them with the king's portrait at the Royal Mint using official punches, which seems to be asking for trouble. Edward I Type 1 Penny Jeton, 1282-1289 Tower. Copper, 20mm, 1.65g. Bust of king facing, inside border of rosettes. Cross pattée, fleurs at ends, sun and moon in angles, inside border of rosettes (Mernick Series 2a, Obverse 2a.8, Reverse 15, based on a penny of Fox Class 4). 6 1 1 Quote
Anaximander Posted December 7, 2024 · Member Author Posted December 7, 2024 Here's a Sterling site with a lot more of information on that popular penny: Sterling Imitations. Some 300 such coins with images and information on a free-to-share basis. It was set up in 2013 and updated into 2020, but since then... Such a good resource. Consult it while you still can! 1 Quote
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