Here is another coin that belongs to the Bible

[lim]

The description says - the journey of the Magi. It's just not clear what this type of coin has to do with the Magi? In the Scriptures, they went with gifts from Arabia to Egypt. This coin was used in the territory of Avganistan.

[shanxi]

If you Google Azes and Magi, you will find several descriptions of Caspar as a representative of Azes. Strangely, however, these descriptions are usually attached to overpriced coins of Azes. 

 

But nice coin !

Edited December 3, 2024 by shanxi

[lim]

And that's not clear yet. The coin in the description is worth 50-12 BC. And Jesus was born about 4 BC. The coin was issued earlier.

[shanxi]

Here is one of this description I mentioned:

https://www.banknoteworld.com/journey-of-the-magi-silver-tetradrachm-coin-w-coa.html

 

The reason they are sold as magi coins is that the representative of Azes, who is supposed to be Caspar, financed his journey with these coins.

I don't believe a word of it.

Edited December 3, 2024 by shanxi

[lim]

And what does it have to do with the Bible?

[shanxi]

4 minutes ago, lim said:

And what does it have to do with the Bible?

Truthfully, I have never read the original text, but I do remember the children's version, and are Caspar, Melchior Bathazar not in the Bible?

Edited December 3, 2024 by shanxi

[lim]

Here you have given a link. It says here. That Kaspar and several others were court astrologers . And scientists believe that these astrologers were allegedly directed by Azes 2 himself, at the time of Jesus' birth. And he sent them to pay homage to the newborn Jesus. And they almost certainly used these coins on the road.

Edited December 3, 2024 by lim

[lim]

Logically, it still doesn't add up. The reign of Azes was from 50-12 BC. And Jesus was born in 4 BC. How could Azes 2 send them? He was already gone.

[lim]

If Jesus had been born in 12 BC, then it would have been consistent.

[CPK]

In my mind, this is a pretty far-fetched connection.

5 hours ago, shanxi said:

Truthfully, I have never read the original text, but I do remember the children's version, and are Caspar, Melchior Bathazar not in the Bible?

Nope. No names are given. The Bible doesn't even specify how many wise men there were. The common conception that there were three arises, I think, from the fact that three different gifts (gold, frankincense, and myrrh) were presented to the infant Jesus. As for where the magoi came from, all the text says is "...there came wise men from the east...", nothing more. (Matthew 2:1)

5 hours ago, lim said:

Logically, it still doesn't add up. The reign of Azes was from 50-12 BC. And Jesus was born in 4 BC. How could Azes 2 send them? He was already gone.

Is the argument that Azes actually sent the magoi, or simply that they used his coins? Since his coinage would likely have been in circulation for years after his death.

 

[kirispupis]

I must admit that I'm not familiar with the text, but whether someone was simply using the coinages of Azes or was sent by him, that would imply this person/people are actually based in the Indo-Skythian territory of Azes (roughly Jalalabad), right?

Per ChatGPT:

Route Options:

• The Northern Route (Silk Road): Travelers might pass through northern Persia, Mesopotamia, and then south toward Jerusalem. This route would include stops in cities like Herat, Tehran (ancient Rhagae), Babylon, and Damascus.
• The Southern Route: This might involve passing through Kandahar, the Persian Gulf region, and Mesopotamia, then onward to Jerusalem.

2. Distance:

• Jalalabad to Jerusalem is approximately 3,000–3,500 kilometers (1,860–2,175 miles) depending on the route.

3. Travel Speeds:

• On Foot: A traveler could cover approximately 20–25 km/day (12–15 miles/day) under good conditions.
• Camel Caravan: Often used for long-distance trade, caravans could travel 25–40 km/day (15–25 miles/day), though rest days and stops would slow progress.
• Horseback: Faster but not commonly sustained for long journeys unless highly organized, allowing for 40–50 km/day (25–30 miles/day).

4. Estimated Duration:

• On Foot: Around 4–6 months assuming consistent travel.
• Camel Caravan: Around 3–5 months, accounting for breaks and trade stops.
• Horseback (relay or express): A wealthy traveler using a relay system for horses might reduce this to around 2–3 months, though this would be rare in 4 BCE.

5. Challenges:

• Geography: Mountain passes, deserts, and rivers would add delays.
• Seasonal Weather: Travel in winter or summer extremes would slow progress.
• Political and Social Factors: Travelers might face border controls, banditry, or the need to detour due to conflicts.

 

Weren't there any closer kings they could have sent "It's a boy!" notices to? What was wrong with Nabataea, Samaria, and maybe a note to the governor of Syria?

[DLTcoins]

9 hours ago, lim said:

The description says - the journey of the Magi. It's just not clear what this type of coin has to do with the Magi? In the Scriptures, they went with gifts from Arabia to Egypt. This coin was used in the territory of Avganistan.

 

It's just nonsense marketing. The Greek word μάγος means "magician", not "king". Indeed the English word "magic" derives from it. The word is used only one other time in the NT, to describe one Simon, a Samaritan sorcerer (Acts 8:9-24). The association with Azes is the creation of a prominent midwestern coin dealer. It has no scholarly basis. In the scripture, the Magi come from "the east", first to Herod, then to Bethlehem, after which they return to "their country" (still unnamed).

[Roman Collector]

9 hours ago, shanxi said:

... are Caspar, Melchior Bathazar not in the Bible?

These names first appear in an eighth century religious chronicle, Excerpta Latina Barbari, which is a Latin translation of a lost Greek manuscript.

[LONGINUS]

Interesting post, @lim that’s a beautiful coin!

I have always been fascinated with Biblical coins. Here's my collection of Judaean coins minted and circulated during the lifetime of Jesus.

Edited December 6, 2024 by LONGINUS

[LONGINUS]

Great topic for discussion, @lim !

Despite my uncertainty about Azes’s role in the journey of the Magi, I find great pleasure in collecting his coins. These Indo-Scythian coins are my first. When I initially bought these boxed sets, I never imagined I would become the avid ancient coin collector I am today. Back then, I was clueless about Indo-Scythian coins, yet the idea that they might have been used by the Magi captivated me. Naturally, the marketing and packaging of these coins also played a significant part in attracting me. I shouldn't be too critical of these marketing tactics, as it was sets like these that sparked my interest in ancient coin collecting in the first place.

 

 

I have accumulated quite a few of them over the years.

 

[Alegandron]

My coin.

INDIA, Indo-Scythian Kings. Azes I. Ca 57-30 BC.
AR Drachm, 2.3g, 15mm, 11h.
Obv.: BAΣIΛEΩΣ BAΣIΛEΩN MEΓAΛOY / AZOY; Emperor on horseback right, holding whip and raising right hand, bow on his back. Karosthi letter in right field.
Rev.: MAHARAJASA RAJARAJASA MAHATASA AYASA; Zeus standing left, holding long scepter and Nike, monograms in right and left fields.
Reference: Senior - ,Whitehead -

Marketing 101:  I hereby certify that me, being a Scholar of Cool, that this is a coin held in the Child Jesus' hand.  See the cool discoloration marks on the surfaces?  Maybe it was a 30 year-old coin at the time, but who has not seen coins from 30-50 years ago in circulation?

Opening bid: